Following are pertinent quotes from the Koran/Quran regarding women, from the Dawood translation with the side-by-side Arabic. Below is also a summary of the koranic view of women, as well as relevant videos by Muslim authorities, expressing a very typical attitude towards women. Please note that millions of children worldwide are forced to learn these koranic scriptures by memory. Note also that women are likewise repeatedly addressed in the hadiths or Islamic sayings and deeds of the Muslim prophet Mohammed/Muhammad. The various hadiths that are supposed to be followed by Muslims are called "sunnah."
Women in the Koran
"They ask you about menstruation. Say: 'It is an indisposition. Keep aloof from women during their menstrual periods and do not approach them until they are clean again; when they are clean, have intercourse with them whence God enjoined you....'" Quran 2:222, "The Cow," Dawood, p. 34
"Women are your fields: go, then, into your fields whence you please." Quran 2:223, "The Cow," Dawood, p. 34
"Men have authority over women because God has made the one superior to the other, and because they spend their wealth to maintain them. Good women are obedient. They guard their unseen parts because God has guarded them. As for those from whom you fear disobedience, admonish them and forsake them in beds apart, and beat them." Quran 4:34, "Women," Dawood, p. 83
"A male shall inherit twice as much as a female." Quran 4:11, "Women," Dawood, p. 77
"Call in two male witnesses from among you, but if two men cannot be found, then one man and two women whom you judge fit to act as witnesses..." Quran 2:282, "The Cow," Dawood, p. 47
"Women shall with justice have rights similar to those exercised against them, although men have a status above women." Quran 2:228, Dawood, p. 35
"If you fear that you cannot treat [orphan girls] with fairness, then you may marry other women who seem good to you: two, three, or four of them. But if you fear that you cannot maintain equality among them, marry one only or any slave-girl you may own." Quran 4:3, "Women," Dawood, p. 76
"If you are in doubt concerning those of your wives who have ceased menstruating, know that their waiting period shall be three months. The same shall apply to those [of your wives] who have not yet menstruated." Quran 65:4, "Divorce," Dawood, p. 557 [Dawood notes: "On account of their young age. Child marriages were common."]
"[Forbidden to you are] married women, except those whom you own as slaves." Quran 4:24, "Women," Dawood, p. 81
"You shall not wed pagan women, unless they embrace the Faith. A believing slave-girl is better than an idolatress, although she may please you. Nor shall you wed idolaters, unless they embrace the Faith." Quran 2:221, "The Cow," Dawood, p. 34.
"Enjoin believing women to turn their eyes away from temptation and to preserve their chastity; not to display their adornments (except such as are normally revealed); to draw their veils over their bosoms and not to display their finery except to their husbands, their fathers, their husbands' fathers, their sons, their step-sons, their brothers, their brothers' sons, their sisters' sons, their women-servants, and their slave-girls; male attendants lacking in natural vigour, and children who have no carnal knowledge of women. And let them not stamp their feet when walking so as to reveal their hidden trinkets." Quran 24:31, "Light," Dawood, p. 352
"Wives of the Prophet, you are not like other women. If you fear God, do not be too complaisant in your speech, lest the lecherous-hearted should lust after you. Show discretion in what you say. Stay in your homes and do not display your finery as women used to in the days of ignorance." Quran 33:32-3, Dawood, p. 421 [The "days of ignorance" refer to pre-Islamic times.]
Summary of Koranic quotes regarding women
Menstruating women are unclean, and men must stay away from them. Women are men's "fields," and men can have sex with them whenever they want. Men are superior to women and have authority over them, while women must obey men or risk being beaten. A woman is worth one-half of a man, and men are above women. Muslim men may marry up to four wives, including prepubescent girls, and can own sex slaves. Muslims are not allowed to marry non-Muslims, unless the latter convert to Islam. Women must cover themselves and be seen only by relatives, eunuchs, slaves and children who have not yet had sex with women.
The Koran also contains more equitable commentary on women, although these verses are widely ignored, even or especially in Islamic/sharia law and particularly by "radical" or devout Muslims such as the Taliban, Wahhabis, Salafis and Iranian Shiites. Even in these "equitable" verses the attitude is retained that women are inferior to and possessions of men, to be treated accordingly. Whether or not a master is exhorted to be kind, fair and just to his slaves, the fact of their slavery remains.
Further Reading
Dancing women brought disaster to Pakistan
Women's rights in Islam
Comments (74)
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|2011-08-17 14:08:56 wasim ahmad ...The TruthThe various aspects of the life of the Holy Prophet (peace and blessings of Allah be upon him) are all so sublime, that in the matter of choice, a writer on the subject soon finds himself baffled and selection becomes very nearly impossible. In consideration of present day needs, however, I wish to take up that side of the Holy Prophet’s life which concerns the way in which he purged the world of that form of utter slavery which had been for all time the curse of humanity. I mean the slavery of women.
Before the advent of the Holy Prophet (peace and blessings of Allah be upon him) women in all countries were in the position of slaves and chattels, and their slavery could not but have reacted adversely even on men; for sons of slaves cannot assimilate the spirit of freedom.
There is no doubt woman, either because of her beauty or because of her sterling character, has always been able, in individual cases, to dominate over men, but freedom thus obtained could not be termed true freedom, for the simple reason that it was not hers by way of right. It was only a matter of exception to the general rule, and freedom which is exceptional, can hardly lead to the culture of true aspirations.
The Holy Prophet (peace and blessings of Allah be upon him) had his advent about 1,350 years ago. Before his time, no religion or nation afforded to woman such freedom as she could use by way of right. Of course in countries where no law prevailed, she was free from all disabilities. Yet even this kind of freedom cannot be called true freedom. It is rather described as license. True freedom is that which is reaped out of a state of civilization and conformity to law. The sort of freedom we get when we break the bounds of the law is not freedom at all because such freedom does not generate any strength of character.
II
At the time of the Holy Prophet (peace and blessings of Allah be upon him) and before, woman was placed in a condition in which she was not the owner of her property; her husband was regarded as the owner of her property. She did not have a share in the property of her father. Nor could she inherit the property of her husband, though in some cases she had the right of managing it during the husband’s lifetime. When married, she was either assigned to her husband for good as his property, and in no circumstances could she be separated from him; or in the alternative, it was given to the husband to divorce her but not given to her to separate herself from the husband, however afflicted she might have been.
Should the husband desert her, cease to discharge his obligations towards her or run away from her, there was no law to protect her. It was obligatory on her to be resigned to her lot, and work for a living both for herself and her children. The husband was entitled, out of bad temper, to beat his wife; she was not to raise a voice against it. Should the husband die, the wife, in some countries, fell into the hands of her husband’s relatives, who could then marry her to whomsoever they liked, either in charity or in return of some benefits received. In some places, on the other hand, she was merely the property of her husband. Some husbands would sell their wives or lose them in gambling and betting, and when they did so, they were all considered to be within their rights.
A woman had no right over her children whether in her position of dependence as wife, or in a position of independence of her husband. In domestic affairs she had no privilege. Even in religion she had no status. Of the abiding spiritual blessings, she was to have no share. In consequence, husbands used to squander the property of their wives and abandon them without providing for their subsistence. She could not, even out of her own property, give away, in charity, or help her relatives except with the consent of her husband, and a husband who looked with greed on the property of his wife could hardly give his consent in such a matter.
Of the property of her parents, to whom children are bound by a most deep and affectionate tie, woman was deprived of all share. And yet daughters have as much claim on their parents as have the sons. Parents who out of a sense of justice, would give away during their lifetime some of their property to their daughters, prepared only for strife in their families. It would not occur to the sons that after the parent’s death they (the sons) would inherit the whole of their property (and therefore should not grudge their sisters receiving occasional gifts from their parents); all they considered was that their sisters, for the time being were having more than they.
Of the property, similarly, of her husband -- with whom a wife has the relation of complete union -- woman was again, deprived altogether. Distant relatives of the husband could each claim a share, but not the wife -- one, indeed, who was the possessor of his confidence, a life-long partner of his and whose labour and care must have so largely contributed to his income. On the other hand, when she managed all her husband’s property, she did not have any genuine right over any portion of it. While she could spend out of the income of that property she could not dispose any part of it. In acts of charity, therefore, she was prevented from taking part in the manner she liked.
When the husband oppressed his wife, she could not be separated from him. In communities in which separation was at all possible, it was on conditions under which self-respecting women preferred death to separation. For instance, a condition of separation was that proof should be furnished establishing the misconduct of either party, as well as ill treatment on the part of the husband. What was still worse was that in cases in which it was impossible for a woman to live with her husband instead of complete separation, she was only allowed to live apart, a state of living which itself is a form of torture, for in this way she was compelled to lead an empty, purposeless life.
In some cases it happened that while the husband could divorce his wife whenever he liked, the wife in no case could demand a divorce. If the husband deserted her, or abandoned the country without providing for her, she was obliged to linger through life without the right to devote herself usefully to her country or community. Married life, instead of being a life of happiness, became for her a life of misery. Her obligation it was, not only to undertake the duties of her husband and of herself but also to wait for her husband. The duty of the husband, namely to find a living for the household, became hers, as also her own duty, the care and upbringing of her children?mental discomfort on the one hand, and material responsibilities on the other.
All this, in short, was tolerated in the case of this poor, unprotected creature. Women were beaten and considered the property of their husbands. When the husbands died, widows were forcefully married to the relatives of their husbands, or else sold for money. In fact, husbands themselves sold away their wives. Indian princes like the Panawas lost their wife (there was one for many) in gambling, and against the law of the land, a noble princess like Dropadi could not raise the slightest voice.
In the education or upbringing of their children, the mothers were not consulted and they had no rights over their children. If the father and mother separated, the children were handed over to the father. Woman had nothing to do with the household. Whenever the husband liked, he could drive her out of the house, and she was condemned to wander about homelessly.
III
By the advent of the Holy Prophet (peace and blessings of Allah be upon him) all these iniquities were wiped away, as it were, with one stroke. He declared that God had particularly entrusted to him the task of safeguarding the rights of women.
He proclaimed in the name of God that man and woman by virtue of their humanity, were the equal of each other, and when they lived together, just as man had certain rights over woman, so had woman certain rights over man. Women could own property in the same way as men. A husband had no right to use the property of his wife, as long as the wife, of her own free will, did not let him have some of it. To seize her property by force, or in a manner which made it doubtful whether her natural shyness had not stood in the way of her refusal, was wrong. Whatever the husband of his own free will should give away to the wife, would be the property of the wife and the husband would not be able to take it back from her. She was to inherit the property of her parents just as well as her brothers. Only considering that all the family responsibilities fall on man, and woman’s concern is her own self alone, her share was to be one half of the share of man, that is, out of the property of their (deceased) parents.
Similarly a mother was to have a share in the property of her (deceased) son as well as the father. Only according to differing circumstances and the nature of her responsibilities in particular cases, she was to have a share at times equal to, and at times less than that of the father. On the death also of her husband she was to inherit, whether or not there were any children, because she was not to be condemned to a state of dependence on others.
Her marriage (it was granted) is, without doubt, a holy alliance, which, after man and woman have cultivated mutual intimacy to the extreme, it is very detestable to break. However, it cannot be that, even after a frightful divergence of nature has been found between the parties, or in spite of a religious, physical, economic, social or mental discrepancy between them, they should be compelled, in the interest of sheer alliance, to ruin their lives and kill the purpose of their existence.
When differences of this kind appear, and man and woman agree that they cannot live together, they can (it was taught), by mutual consent, revoke the alliance. If, however, only the husband should take this view, but not the wife, and if they fail to adjust themselves to each other, their affairs should be considered by a committee of two members, one representing the husband and the other the wife. If the committee should decide that the parties should yet make an effort to live together, it would be worthwhile on their part to try to settle their differences in the way recommended by the committee. Then if the understanding along this line should prove impossible, the husband could divorce the wife, but in such a case he would have no right to the return of whatever he might have (before divorce) given away to her, including the full value of mahr (marriage settlement).
If, on the other hand, the wife should seek separation, and not the husband, she should apply to the Qazi (Judge), and if the Qazi is satisfied that there is no unfair motive behind her application, he should order her separation. Only in such a case she will make over to the husband such of his property as had been entrusted to her, as also the value of mahr (marriage settlement). Should the husband fail to fulfil his marital obligations or cease to speak to her, or should ask her to sleep apart, he should not be able to go beyond a certain limit of time. If he persists for four months in this kind of treatment, he should be compelled either to reform himself or to divorce her.
Should he stop the allowances due to the wife or go away from her and no longer take care of her, their marriage should be regarded as null and void. (Three years have been assigned as the limit of the period of abandonment by Muslim jurists). The wife would now be free to marry again.
The husband was always to be responsible for the maintenance of his wife and children. He was to exercise only appropriate discipline, but should this discipline ever take the form of punishment, he should have proper witnesses and declare her guilt and base his judgment on evidence. Punishment should not leave any permanent ill effects behind.
A husband does not own his wife. He cannot sell her, nor reduce her to the office of domestic drudge. His wife shares with him the amenities of the household, and his treatment of her will have to correspond to the position to which he himself belongs. A treatment which is below that which should belong to the status of the husband would be wrong.
On the death of her husband, his people were to have no right over her. She would be free, and a suitable opportunity occurring, she would have the right to marry again. Nobody can stop her from doing so. Nor can a widow be compelled to live in a particular place. Only for about four months and ten days, she would live in her husband’s house, so that all those conditions which can have a bearing on her rights and on those of her husband’s people, should have time to manifest themselves.
For a year after the death of her husband a widow, whatever else is due to her, is to have in addition, the use of her husband's house, so that she should be able, out of what has been left to her, to make arrangements for her residence.
Should the husband find himself not on good terms with his wife, he himself is to keep out of the house, not ask his wife to go out of it, because the household is supposed to be the possession of the wife. In the upbringing of the children, woman has her part. She is to be consulted.
In the matter of children, her interest is not to be ignored in any way. Wet nursing, general caretaking, are to depend on her advice. If husband and wife, finding it impossible any more to live together, should want to separate from each other, the care of the small children should be entrusted to the mother. When they grow up, they should for purpose of education, come back to the father. As long as the children live with their mother, maintenance would be provided for by the father. The father would also pay for the time and labour the mother would have to spend on account of the children.
Woman, in short, was to have an independent status. All the spiritual rewards were to be open to her. She was to command the highest excellences of life after death and even in this life she could take part in the different departments of civil administration. In this regard she was to have the same consideration paid to her claims as that accorded to man.
IV
This is the teaching which the Holy Prophet (peace and blessings of Allah be upon him) promulgated at a time when the standards of the world were altogether opposed to it. Through these injunctions, he reclaimed women from the slavery which had been their lot for thousands of years, to which they were forced in every land, and the yoke of which every religion had put on their neck. One man, in one time, cut asunder all these chains of serfdom! Bringing freedom to mothers, he at the same time saved their children from slavish sentiments, and provided for the germination and nourishment of great ambition and high resolve!
However, the world did not value the teachings. What was indeed a boon, it branded as tyranny. Divorce and separation it regarded as strife, inheritance as ruining the family, independence of woman as means of the disruption of domestic life. For thirteen hundred years, it went on ridiculing, in its blindness, the things which this one man who could see, had communicated to mankind for their good. It went on condemning his teachings as against human nature. Then came the time when the exquisiteness of the word of God (transmitted through the Holy Prophet) should reveal itself. The very peoples who looked upon themselves as the bearers of civilization, began to obey the civilizing injunctions of the Holy Prophet. Everyone of these peoples in turn, changed their laws in increasing conformity to the principles preached by the Holy Prophet (on whom be peace).
The English Law which required misconduct, ill treatment and beating on the part of either party as essential conditions of divorce, was changed in 1923. Misconduct by itself was accepted by the new law as a sufficient excuse for divorce.
New Zealand decided, in 1912, that a wife who has been insane for seven years, should have her marriage dissolved. In 1925, it further ruled that if either husband or wife should not discharge his or her marital obligations, they could be allowed a divorce or separation. If three years elapse without one caring for the other, divorce was in order. A good imitation of Muslim jurists, of course, but made after 1,300 years of attacks on Islam!
In the Australian State of Queensland, insanity of five years’ duration was regarded as a sufficient reason for divorce. In Tasmania, a law was passed in 1919 that misconduct, desertion for four years, drunkenness, indifference for three years, imprisonment, beating, insanity, should, one and all, be sufficient conditions of divorce. In Victoria, law was passed in 1923 that should a husband fail to look after his wife for three years, be guilty of misconduct, refuse allowances, or ill-treat his wife, divorce would be possible. Further, it was granted that imprisonment, beating, misconduct on the part of the wife, insanity, unfair treatment and constant strife shall be sufficient excuses for divorce or separation.
In Western Australia, besides the laws outlined above, the marriage of a pregnant woman has been declared to be void. (Islam, too, holds the same view).
In the island of Cuba it was decided in 1918 that forcing into misconduct, beating, using foul language, undergoing conviction, drunkenness, gambling habit, failure to discharge obligations, refusing allowances, infectious disease, or mutual agreement, shall be accepted as sufficient conditions for divorce or separation.
Italy enacted in 1919 that a woman shall have rights over her property. She can spend out of it in charity or sell it as she likes (Up to this time, in Europe, she was not recognized as the owner of her own property).
In Mexico, too, the above conditions have been accepted as being sufficient for divorce. Besides, mutual agreement has also been accepted as sufficient. This law has been passed in 1917. Portugal in 1915, Norway in 1909, Sweden in 1920, and Switzerland in 1912, have passed laws by which divorce and separation have been made permissible. In Sweden, a father is compelled by law to provide, at least up to eighteen years, for the maintenance of every child of his.
In the United States of America although the law of the land continues to maintain the right of a father over his child, yet in practice the judges have begun to pay regard to the susceptibilities of mothers, and a father is now even compelled to pay for the children (living with their mother). There are, of course many drawbacks in their law. Even though, the man’s rights have been more strictly guarded, woman is being allowed to exercise right over the property. At the same time, in many States it has been passed that if the husband should become a permanent invalid, his wife will have to provide for him.
Women are now being granted the right to vote, and avenues are being opened by which they can come to have a voice in matters of national concern. Yet all these things are coming after full thirteen hundred years have passed since the Holy Prophet (peace and blessings of Allah be upon him) promulgated his teachings. There are many things which yet await coming. In many countries a woman has still no share in the inheritance of either her parents or her husband. Similarly, in several other matters Islam continues to provide guidance to the world, though the world has not acknowledged such guidance. The time is not distant, however, when the world will accept the guidance coming from the Holy Prophet (peace and blessings of Allah be upon him) in these matters as it has already done in others, and which the Holy Prophet initiated on behalf of the freedom of women will bring forth its fruits to the full
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|2011-08-17 17:05:52 Acharya SThanks for the drive-by spam full of utter nonsense.
There's next-to-nothing "subtle" about Islam. It's about as gritty as it gets.
Despite all the meaningless mumbo-jumbo and mindless apologizing, the fact will remain that Islam is highly misogynistic.
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|2011-08-16 21:31:44 Amil Imani - The value of women in IslamThank you for such an eye opening article, Acharya. You have always been at the forefront of fight against discriminatory laws against women. Islam, by fiat, discriminates against women. Qur’an 4:11 “Allah directs you in regard of your Children’s (inheritance): to the male, a portion equal to that of two females…. These are settled portions ordained by Allah.”
There are many more “directives” that for all intents and purposes make women chattel of men. Here are some of the shameful rules and practices of Islamic misogyny.
Women are inferior to men:
“Men have authority over women because God has made the one superior to the other, and because they spend their wealth to maintain them. Good women are obedient. They guard their unseen parts because God has guarded them. As for those whom you fear disobedience, admonish them and send them to beds apart and beat them. Then if they obey you, take no further action against them. Surely God is most high. Qur'an 4:34
Women are worth half of man:
“Narrated Abu Said Al-Khudri: The Prophet said, "Isn't the witness of a women equal to half that of a man?" The women said "yes". He said "This is because of the deficiency of the women's mind." Sahih Bukhari 3:48:82
Women are sex slaves:
“And now, people, you acquire certain rights over your wives, and they do you. The right you acquire over them is that they should not let someone you hate sleep in your beds, and not to commit a manifest obscenity [or adultery]. If they do [commit it], then God has given you permission to leave them alone in their beds and give them a beating, though not too hard. If they give over, they get their provision and clothing with kindness; I command you good-will for your wives, for they are your captives that do not own anything of their own. You have taken them by the faithfulness of God, and made their sexual organs lawful for you by the words of God.” Ibn Hisham, al-Sira al-nabawiyya (Cairo, 1963), 4:251.
Women are Toys:
“Omar [one of the Khalifs] was once talking when his wife interjected, so he said to her: 'You are a toy, if you are needed we will call you.” Al-Musanaf Vol. 1 Part 2, p. 263
Women are Weak:
Narrated Anas bin Malik: The Prophet had a Had (a camel driver) called Anjasha, and he had a nice voice. The Prophet said to him, "(Drive) slowly, O Anjasha! Do not break the glass vessels!" And Qatada said, "(By vessels') he meant the weak women." Sahih Bukhari 8:73:230, See also: Sahih Bukhari 8:73:228 & Sahih Bukhari 8:73:229
Women are a Tilth for Men to Cultivate:
“Your wives are as a tilth unto you; so approach your tilth when or how ye will; but do some good act for your souls beforehand; and fear Allah. And know that ye are to meet Him (in the Hereafter), and give (these) good tidings to those who believe.” Qur'an 2:223
Women are Like Devils
Jabir reported that Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) saw a woman, and so he came to his wife, Zainab, as she was tanning a leather and had sexual intercourse with her. He then went to his Companions and told them: The woman advances and retires in the shape of a devil, so when one of you sees a woman, he should come to his wife, for that will repel what he feels in his heart. Sahih Muslim 8:3240
Woman are Evil Omen:
Narrated 'Abdullah bin 'Umar: I heard the Prophet saying. "Evil omen is in three things: The horse, the woman and the house." Sahih Bukhari 4:52:110
Men May Marry up to Four Women”
“If you fear you can not treat orphans (girls) with fairness, then you may marry other women who seem good to you: two, three or four of them. But if you fear that you can not maintain equality among them, marry only one or any slave girls you may own, that will be more suitable. And give the women their dower as a free gift; but if they, of their own good pleasure, remit any part of it to you, eat it with enjoyment, take it with right good cheer and absorb it (in your wealth).” Qur'an 4:3
Violence Against Women”
“Men are the maintainers of women because Allah has made some of them to excel others and because they spend out of their property; the good women are therefore obedient, guarding the unseen as Allah has guarded; and (as to) those on whose part you fear desertion, admonish them, and leave them alone in the sleeping-places and beat them; then if they obey you, do not seek a way against them; surely Allah is High, Great.” Qur'an 4:34
The Afterlife of Women:
“Narrated Abu Said Al-Khudri: Once Allah's Apostle went out to the Musalla (to offer the prayer) o 'Id-al-Adha or Al-Fitr prayer. Then he passed by the women and said, "O women! Give alms, as I have seen that the majority of the dwellers of Hell-fire were you (women)." They asked, "Why is it so, O Allah's Apostle ?" He replied, "You curse frequently and are ungrateful to your husbands. I have not seen anyone more deficient in intelligence and religion than you. A cautious sensible man could be led astray by some of you." The women asked, "O Allah's Apostle! What is deficient in our intelligence and religion?" He said, "Is not the evidence of two women equal to the witness of one man?" They replied in the affirmative. He said, "This is the deficiency in her intelligence. Isn't it true that a woman can neither pray nor fast during her menses?" The women replied in the affirmative. He said, "This is the deficiency in her religion." Sahih Bukhari 1:6:301
Women are relegated in Islam at best, to a second-class status, depriving them of many rights enjoyed by men. Thus, life goes on for the Muslim women with all the trappings of the Islamic misogyny. Such is the plight of women under Islam. There is hardly the need to provide an exhaustive list of Islamic misogyny to qualify it as a shameful, discriminatory and oppressive religious apartheid.
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|2011-08-17 10:03:01 Anonymous
The muslim religion is a religion of violence and abuse to women. What do muslims think they are? Arent they born from a woman. When they treat women like this they are not even respecting the fact that they came from one woman. Sad things, sorry for the muslim women.ioigi
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|2011-09-07 09:12:27 ashu - respect the womb which bore u-quranquran-respect the womb who bore u-this is verse of the quran
be kind to ur wife-verse of the quran
quran is msg to the whole of mankind
it says shun idol worship-man worship-grave worship and pray to the creator of the universe
it says shun shamelessness,evil behaviour
do the read the quran with open mind
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|2011-09-08 05:50:35 AnonymousNone of that makes any differences whatsoever, when you know the quotes in this article. It's clear that you didn't even read the quotes from the Koran in this article, nor did you watch any of the videos from a plethora of Muslim authorities in different countries, all spewing misogyny and sexism.
Yes, read the Koran with an open mind - especially if you're a Muslim whose mind has been brainwashed, believing that the Koran is somehow good for women.
Sorry, but the Koran with its infidel-hatred and women abuse is NOT for all of mankind. It is absolutely NOT for me in any way, shape or form.
You are unfortunately brainwashed, but you can free yourself by reading studying the following sites:
Islam Reality Videos
Quotes from the Quran
The Religion of Peace
270 Million Murdered by Islam
Faith Freedom
Islam Watch
Jihad Watch
Amil Imani
Prophet of Doom
Islamic Crusades
Women's Rights in Islaml
Good luck.
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|2012-06-14 15:53:26 AnonymousRead the quran yourself deciever/decieved guy. And read the quran and hadiths on this page and in the comments above and below you too.
Your little verse of tolerance that Mohamed did not follow and that Mohamed commanded muslims to do things which negated your verse,,is pathetic against all the horrible verses and hadiths written on this page.
Muslim lies will not make anyone believe in islam anymore. if the person ever reads these quran verses, hadiths, sirat.
And whatever people do convert, they are never sure of being kept. Because they can read the truth about islam and choose to leave it at any time in their whole life. And a convert you win now might leave in a year or two. And if not in a year or two, they will surely leave in their lifetime, and encourage their children to leave too. (many people do not care about the death penalty commanded by mohamed and sharia for leaving islam, when they see they have been lied to and would not follow a religion just out of fear of death, unlike some born muslims)
Converts have known human rights, they will never give them up. Except the few sociopaths who have no care about human rights at all.
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|2013-02-10 19:26:19 esam - think right before saing anythingmy what ? look you did not understand what the god mean for of your lot of sins you committed but can you say that in that community i mean the west do you now have girls babe till 25yrd tell me i can tell you must of them are braked in nonlegal way if it is legal why you make that big ceremony in wedding let it go in that bad ways ....look to go in straight way take that one the creator ALLAH want COS it is the right way didn't he know what the good ways and bad for his creatures i will teach you if you want am here (esamisha@yahoo.com)
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|2011-08-17 14:02:27 woz - ISLAM A BEAUTIFUL RELIGIONIt must be remembered that at the time Islam was revealed to the world infant girls were buried alive in Arabia and women had no rights at all .Islam gave women the right to inheritance and to divorce , women have a special place in Islam and are respected.
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|2011-08-17 17:02:42 Acharya SThis post itself contradicts your claims. Islam treats women as second-class citizens, period, and no amount of fallacious apologizing will change that fact. This "special place" for women is at the back of the bus, so to speak.
Yes, we've heard the standard parroted apology about the baby girls being buried - this misogynistic "custom" of killing female infants has been practiced in many cultures over the millennia and continues in many places. Many Muslims continue to engage in killing off their females, in "honor killings," so this apology serves as a mere deflection off the blatant Islamic misogyny.
Moreover, in many ways the pre-Islamic "Arab" spiritual and religious traditions were far superior to what Islam has brought to the world, especially as concerns the fact that there were GODDESSES in the pre-Islamic religion of the region, rather than just one giant male god in the sky. The memory of these goddesses was wiped out, so that no woman would have a clue about the concept of the Divine Feminine. Islam represents an utter subjugation of women's spiritual traditions and is one of the WORST things ever to happen to females.
Quote:Banish Them to Their Beds and Scourge Them! Muhammad’s Low Opinion ...
Muslim apologists have done an outstanding job convincing people that Muhammad was a champion of women’s rights. Indeed, arguments for Muhammad’s liberation of women have convinced some that "Muhammad was probably the greatest champion of women’s rights the world has ever seen." Descriptions of Muhammad’s improvements in the area of gender relations abound in Muslim writings:
Quote:So far back as the seventh century of the Christian era, Islam abolished the horrible practice of female infanticide prevalent among the pagan Arabs, gave clear directions leading to the restriction of polygamy, restrained the unlimited rights exercised by men over their wives, and gave woman both spiritual and material equality with man.
Arab human rights were quite backward, even for the time. Women had precious few rights. A woman became the property of a man upon marriage, and no woman could refuse a match made by her father. Spousal abuse was rampant, with no recourse to any quarter for help. Upon the death of her husband, a woman could be inherited by her son and made her son’s wife. Female infanticide in which newborn baby girls were buried alive in the sand was quite common in a society that considered surplus females a burden. Women had no divorce or well-defined inheritance rights and certainly no political vote. A man could divorce without reason and leave a woman penniless, and there was no limit to the number of wives a man could have, nor rules for how each should be treated. . . . Arabian custom had always dictated that women should take no public role in religious or political activity. The superiority of men over women in all respects was also a widely accepted notion. Muhammad changed that notion by asserting that men and women were equals before God in every sphere. . . . To examine the record of Muhammad and his mission is to gain a new respect for the improvements he made in the lives of both men and women.
The Qur’an provided women with explicit rights to inheritance, to property, the obligation to testify in a court of law, and the right to divorce. It made explicit prohibitions on the use of violence against female children and women as well as on duress in marriage and community affairs. . . . Women were equally responsible for ensuring that all religious duties of the individual and society were fulfilled, in terms of punishment for social, criminal and moral infractions. They were also offered equal opportunities to attain the ultimate boon: paradise and proximity to Allah if they strove with all their means to ‘establish what is good and forbid what is evil’.
While it is true that Muhammad raised the status of Arabian women in some respects, we cannot let this fact cloud certain other issues, namely, (1) that Muhammad permitted husbands to beat their wives, (2) that he repeatedly proclaimed the inferiority of women’s intellectual abilities, (3) that he taught that women’s prospects for the afterlife are extremely bleak, and (4) that, according to Muhammad, it is acceptable for men to rape their female captives. When combined with the above passages describing Muhammad’s beneficial impact on society, these four facts allow us to arrive at a more accurate and well-rounded picture of Muhammad’s view of women.
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|2013-01-23 07:24:20 AnonymousI do not see how that is even remotely pertinent considering the status of women during this time period. Of course it was okay to beat women. An englishman used to proclaim that women should never think because it would take the blood away from their uterus and into their brain making them infertile... if it was said in 19th century England why would you expect more from Muhammad?? Rape has always been a horrid tool used in war. It is still used today in many areas of Africa. It is sick psychological warfare but nontheless it still is promoted. How can you expect Muhhammad to have solved EVERY gender issue during that time period? To assume failure because there are still issues is irrelevant and ignorant.
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|2013-01-23 10:07:09 Acharya SWhat is not "even remotely pertinent?" The widespread abuse of women in the Muslim world based on the Koranic verses, which are held by hundreds of millions as eternal?
This continuing abuse more certainly is extremely pertinent - especially to all these abused women and girls.
It is ridiculous to excuse the behaviors and doctrines of someone held up to be the "Last Prophet of God" and the "Perfect Man." If "Allah" is omnipotent and omniscient, "he" could easily have told Mohammed to end all abuse of women, rather than having the man go on a rampage, slaughter hundreds, take their wives as sex slaves and leave this horrible legacy. It is quite obvious that such a person is not a "prophet of God." On the contrary. There are millions of people far better to follow than this sex slaver, who didn't even know right from wrong.
There is NO excuse. Anyone with half an iota of innate morality and common decency would know that this attitude, these verses and this history are simply wrong. Stop with the excuses, which are pathetic.
But at least one is not denying this fact of Islamic women abuse for a change. Calling it "not even remotely pertinent" is really shameful, however.
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|2013-06-02 05:36:41 AnonymousIt is 2013 and Muslim women continue to be beaten, killed, and raped. But let me guess, that is somehow justifiable?
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|2012-06-14 16:02:39 AnonymousBurying babies alive was already banned by Christianity and Judaism in the arabian peninsula, Mohamed was just copying their humane idea.
And there is no proof that anyone ever buried babies at the time of Mohamed, except for maybe a single arab tribe who were in a famine and did not have food to feed them. And that is not even proven either.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Infanticide
Muslims take the credit for everything, even when they didn't do it first.
And muslims take credit for things, even when it is not even true about it being in islam for many other claims. Like : islam is peace, islam is mercy, islam is human rights (it is against human rights), islam is not killing women or elderly.
See: the killing of Umm Qirfa
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=htcrNQYBAKA
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|2011-08-17 16:50:14 Ron - Just how are we morally superiorIn North America it's a fact that most marriages end in divorce and it is a joke as to how unfair the settlements are. Honourable people do not expect more than half in such situations. Honourable people do not expect payments for 20 years. All men that I know are more than honourable. They give everything away freely but harbour a certain resentment towards paying the ex-wife's way for the next two decades. When I divorced I gave the house and furniture away without hiring my own lawyer but advised wife not to come after my paycheck or I would put up a legal fight and then leave the country to resettle somewhere Islamic where my paycheck would be my own.
I have travelled in many Arab countries and the men there are decent and honourable. With the legal power left in their hands marital disputes are much more likely to be resolved fairly. Religion aside and law aside men usually will not take more than their fair share in any situation even if their religion or legal system allows for it. The reason is that it would offend their sense of manhood. They would feel shame in the presence of other men.
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|2011-08-17 17:40:57 Acharya SAh yes, the cultural relativity argument and "tu quoque" distraction fallacy. Newsflash: Two wrongs don't make a right.
First of all, the reason there are so many divorces in the West is because WOMEN HAVE THE RIGHT TO DIVORCE, as opposed to in the Muslim world, where women must once again submit to the men for that "right," whereas men can divorce at will. So, thanks for highlighting that inequality under Islamic law.
Secondly, who is the "we?" I speak for myself, and I am most certainly morally superior to a Stone Age sexist cult. I also don't particularly care about either marriage or divorce. Why get married in the first place? If you truly love someone, you can make your own vows without any kind of social sanction. You can then split apart if or when you no longer want to share your lives together.
"All men that I know are more than honourable." ALL men you know - really? You've never known a single man who has done anything wrong or dishonorable? Wow - that must be a world's record, or you only know a handful of men, which would hardly make you an expert on the subject.
"I have travelled in many Arab countries and the men there are decent and honourable."
And you are a MAN. I would wager that if a woman like me traveled through many Arab countries dressed as I prefer, I would be severely abused left and right by countless "decent and honourable" men. How soon we forget Laura Logan!
You also didn't watch the video by Dr. Wafa Sultan, nor are you aware, apparently, of the horrendous abuse of women and girls all over the Arab world at the hands of men. Your anecdotal dismissal does all these females a real disservice.
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|2011-08-17 18:26:00 wayneI read the Koran some years ago before all of the current Moslem bashing began. It was a small part of my efforts to educate myself. I do remember that Mohammad was big on seeing to it that women received their inheritance and that it was not to be taken from them. He felt the same way about orphans.
In the modern west, it is OK for a woman to be abused by her lesbian master, wasting her life in mental illness and without a family; or to be a heroin addict prostitute; or to be an insane homeless beggar on the streets, etc. etc.
What's this stuff that Jesus said about mote in eye and plank in eye? Or judge not...........
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|2012-06-14 17:02:00 AnonymousYou can tell who the muslims, or people who didn't read very much of the quran, and none of the hadiths or history, are.
Did you notice 90% of the 5000 honour killings in the world a year are muslims killing women?
And the rest are from indians who had this culture from being under islamic rule in history.
Did you notice the 100 to 140 million women in the world who are living with female genital mutilation, and 3 million a year still being done? Nearly all of who are muslims, and the few rest are converts to christianity who had the practice from being muslims before, or who have it because of islamic rule in history.
In Afghanistan and iran there are many heroin or opium addicts. I don't know why you talk about that.
And you think muslims don't have homeless people?
You are really a muslim or a guy who is totally uneducated about almost anything about islam, despite your claim that educating yourself is what you did. lol
Muslim women have a inferior inheritance like you could read on this page. -- if you can read!
Seriously don't claim you read the quran, when you don't even read the page you commented on.
No-one can believe a person who denies bad about islam, and says good about it. - Because it is not true.
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|2011-08-17 20:17:10 Mohammad - questionsso acharya,
I have read many articles pertaining to the so called "ill treatment" of women in Islam. It is safe to say that your opinions are biased, for whatever reason.
And i find it funny that you only appear to focus your attentions in islam. You in my opinion, do not have a solid understanding of the religion and you choose to use certain versus, without understanding the context of such versus and their application. This is clearly an indicator of your lack of knowledge with regards to islam
Now, whatever abuses against women that are prevalent in so called "Islamic society" if you did your research you would find are culturally based on not religiously based. If you studied the life of the Prophet, you would clearly see how caring he was towards the women of his society, why do you not mention all the sayings of his that are promoting womens rights, why do you not take his life and interactions with women and talk about those. You clearly have an agenda, perhaps that is why.
And furthermore, why do you only talk about islam, when the following religions say the following about women:
Hindus
-still practices female infanticide, infact in the last 10 years, 20 million female babies were killed
-when a woman marries and her husband dies, she has 3 choices, to be burned alive with her husband, to marry his brother or in the case that their is no brother to live in a house for widows, who are considered the lowest of the caste system that india has in place. The movie Water, is evidence of such.
Judaism
-perhaps you have not read the talmud, where not only does it promote racist beliefs against non jews (gentiles) but also states the following, permitting intercourse with children as young as 3:
A Jew may do to a non-Jewess what he can do. He may treat her as he treats a piece of meat.
Hadarine, 20, B; Schulchan Aruch, Choszen Hamiszpat 348
A Jew may violate but not marry a non-Jewish girl.
Gad. Shas. 2:2
A boy-goy after nine years and one day old, and a girl after three years and one day old, are considered filthy.
Pereferkowicz, Talmud t.v., p. 11
Extermination of the Christians is a necessary sacrifice.
Zohar, Shemoth
Jehovah created the non-Jew in human form so that the Jew would not have to be served by beasts. The non-Jew is consequently an animal in human form, and condemned to serve the Jew day and night.
Midrasch Talpioth, p. 225-L
A boy-goy after nine years and one day old, and a girl after three years and one day old, are considered filthy.
Pereferkowicz, Talmud t.v., p. 11
Yevamoth 98a
[Trans.: A non-Jew is "legally fatherless," regardless of whether or not the father is known. Gentile children are essentially asses and horses, i.e., animals.]
R. Joseph said: Come and hear! A maiden aged three years and a day may be acquired in marriage by coition [intercourse], and if her deceased husband's brother cohabits with her, she becomes his. The penalty of adultery may be incurred through her; [if a niddah] she defiles him who has connection with her, so that he in turn defiles that upon which he lies, as a garment which has lain upon [a person afflicted with gonorrhoea].
Sanhedrin 55b
Rab said: Pederasty with a child below nine years of age is not deemed as pederasty with a child above that. Samuel said: Pederasty with a child below three years is not treated as with a child above that.24 (24) I.e., Rab makes nine years the minimum; but if one committed sodomy with a child of lesser age, no guilt is incurred. Samuel makes three the minimum.
Sanhedrin 54b
Raba said. It means this: When a grown-up man has intercourse with a little girl it is nothing, for when the girl is less than this [three years old], it is as if one puts the finger into the eye; but when a small boy has intercourse with a grown-up woman he makes her as 'a girl who is injured by a piece of wood.'...
Why do you not comment on the above.
-Christianity
We all know about original sin and the view that men had towards women, and how they were treated as such as a result of that ideology.
I would advise you to stop your hate mongering and your agenda driven argument and focus on the truth. However, i do not see you doing that.
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|2011-08-17 17:14:23 Acharya S"And i find it funny that you only appear to focus your attentions in islam."
Since you basically begin your diatribe with a statement that demonstrates you know nothing about my work, one must approach the rest of what you have to say with caution. If you did know my work, instead of pretending to do so in order to spew hate speech at me - you would also know that I have spent considerable time criticizing Christianity, Judaism, Buddhism, Hinduism and all other ities and isms that have deleterious aspects. As but one example, I've had an article with pretty much the same Talmudic quotes on my website for well over a decade - nice of you to catch up. Thus, your remark here is utterly false.
You do not know my work, nor are you particularly scientific or rational in your defense of the indefensible. You have no concern for all the vicious defamation in these videos by your co-religionists - you are apparently only concerned about attacking me personally so that I will not bring this abuse to anyone else's attention.
You are also using a typical apologist tactic called "tu quoque," which is to deflect off the subject by pointing fingers elsewhere - we have seen this logical fallacy many times, and it remains fallacious.
"I would advise you to stop your hate mongering and your agenda driven argument and focus on the truth. However, i do not see you doing that."
The only "hate mongering" and "agenda" here are those on your part in spewing hate speech at me personally, when you do not know me at all, and in attempting to get a woman to stop exposing the WOMAN-HATRED of Islam.
It is time for religious fanatics of all stripe to stop trying to bludgeon and intimidate the rest of us into your manmade, misogynistic cults - we will not be bullied. Thank you.
In the meantime, if you would like to know more about what we all have lost because of the rise of these hateful and violent patriarchal and misogynistic cults, please read Man Made God by Barbara G. Walker. The destruction of beauty, innocence, peace and other aspects of human culture by these violent warrior cults is simply appalling, and the truth about it will not be swept under the carpet with hostile defenses of these very destructive cults.
I would advise you to study the origins of the religion you currently hold near and dear - especially as concerns how it was spread and how it destroyed your own ancestors' cultures. You can overcome this conditioning. Cheers.
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|2012-06-14 17:08:03 AnonymousYou mean the talmud and torah where mohamed got most of his ideas for islamic law from? and then made worse by dropping all the jewish reforms and special conditions that the jews had made hundreds of years before, and mohamed sent the islamic laws back to even worse than the first jewish laws.
Is there anything in jewish law that is not the same existing in islam too, except more things and worse?
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|2011-08-17 20:20:28 mimi - Degrading bible verse about womenWomen are inferior to men: "A man is the image and glory of God; but the woman is the glory of man." (1 Cor. 11:7)
Women are weaker than men: "Husbands, in the same way be considerate as you live with your wives, and treat them with respect as the weaker partner" (1 Peter 3:7)
Women should be silent in church: "As in all the congregations of the saints, women should remain silent in the churches." (1 Cor. 14:34)
Women must not have authority over men: "I do not permit a woman to teach or to have authority over a man." (1 Tim. 2:12-14)
Women are saved through bearing children: "But women will be saved through childbearing." (1 Tim. 2:15)
Women must cut their hair off if they don't cover it: "If a woman does not cover her head, she should have her hair cut off." (1 Cor. 11:6)
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|2011-08-17 21:47:03 PaulineThat great mimi but the discussion here is about Islam not Christianity. At what point did it ever become some sort of prerequisite that any time Islam is the topic, Christianity must also be brought up? As Acharya just said above, it's a "tu quoque" distraction fallacy and "Two wrongs don't make a right. "
You'll get no sympathy for Christianity from me, but there are other blogs that discuss Christianity here and I can't help but notice that people are not tripping over themselves to post stuff about Islam in them. I just find it weird that people feel they must bring up Christianity in every thread about Islam but never the reverse.
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|2012-12-26 16:55:46 Kuaka - Women be silent in the churchesContext...it is all about context. Paul was addressing an issue in the Synagogues which still exists today where the men would gather in the middle of the building to discuss matters religious, while the women would gather on the balcony overlooking. It was a problem when a woman would half overhear something and call out to her husband (presumably in the midst of the discussion) for a repeat or explanation. Paul was saying not to do this, and if you half hear something and want to know more wait until you get home and ask your husband who was involved in the discussion.
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|2011-08-17 21:42:57 Xmen - Disinfo agentYou are such a lieing pig Acharya. These portrayals of Muslims and Islam are wahabbists. Why don't you educate your audience in the difference between the two rather than slander all of Islam.
Your ignorance is staggering for someone who thinks she is an intellect.
You are nothing more than a curse spreading misleading information for NWO agenda.
Why not tell everyone the truth about who funds the majority of the "so-called" Islam of this country; Saudi oil money from a extremely corrupt puppet regime of the PTB,
You are a disgrace!
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|2011-08-17 22:26:53 Acharya SThank you for the perfect example of what Islamodefense does to a person's mind. Here I am exposing incredible abuse of women by a wide variety of Muslim authorities, from Saudi Arabia to Palestine to Pakistan to Iran and so on, and you come in and abuse me personally with your hate speech, entirely proving my point about Islamomisogyny.
Here's what we are up against, folks! Tell the truth about vicious bigotry and woman abuse, and you are:
A "disinfo agent"
A "lieing [sic] pig"
A "slanderer"
"Ignorant"
A "curse"
A "disgrace"
All that in a few paragraphs, simply because I dared to expose an ongoing example of appalling suffering that's happening in numerous places based on a particular ideology.
One of the main reasons I do what I do is because mentally disturbed and violent individuals over the past several thousands years have continually persecuted, abused, beaten, tortured and murdered living, breathing and feeling human beings over unfeeling and inanimate ideologies. To me, abusing someone you don't even know in order to defend an ideology, religion, cult, etc., is really quite evil.
So, thanks again for the perfect example of exactly what I'm trying to expose here. Much appreciated.
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|2011-08-18 01:55:25 Gavincurtis - Chromosomes
I am a science guy. Why does the male have less DNA than the female? Do the boys have refined superior firmware or do the gals have extra knowledge?
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|2011-08-20 19:48:52 Z"Why does the male have less DNA than the female? Do the boys have refined superior firmware or do the gals have extra knowledge?"
Well, as I understand it:
The male has less DNA than the female because of an XY pair of chromosomes in the male as opposed to the corresponding XX pair in the female, and the Y is much smaller than the X. The function of the Y chromosome is to flip the developing embryo from its natural base state of female to that of male, with all the well known results. What differences there are are far outweighed by the similarities--or so experience of life has shown me!
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|2011-08-18 02:02:51 oxygen - Truth is the beginnning of all that is good, both
The original Quran is written in classical arabic and any translation is actually an interpretation and carries with it the risk of the author's own bias and cultural stance. This excellent article below explains how the verse 4.34 is often construed as condoning wife beating but the actual meaning is far milder.Allah almighty knows best.
Hope you give it a read
http://irfi.org/articles/articles_251_300/does_the_quran_allow_beating _of.htm
May peace be upon you
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|2011-08-18 11:08:29 Martin Foster - Arrogance justifying cruelty.The arrogance and justified cruelty of Muslim men, is created by their belief in the Quran.
If they would just stop for a moment and think - they would realize that in using cruelty and violence they perpetuate both.
Unfortunately, their belief system is such that all information is filtered through the belief that Mohammed's words were wise. Some of his words may have been wise - but certainly not all.
They need to give recognition to their own consciences, to their own innate abilities to think.
They are in fact suppressing their own minds in order to accommodate these beliefs.
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|2011-08-18 17:42:49 mohammad - are you married?woow, i do feel sorry for you at this point acharya, so much hate in your life, so many enemies that you have, so many battles for you to fight, all in the time span of the 70 or so years we have on this earth. So many men that would be the brunt of your anger and past experiences.
Are you married? Do you have children?
And then what is your solution to all these problems? What society presently in your mind, represents the ideal society with regards to the moral ideas you uphold?
Is it secularism where women are still treated as objects of mens desires, were prostitution is considered legal as a woman has the right to choose her path, were pornography is celebrated as a "freedom", were so called average women are going under the knife in an attempt to beautify themselves according to the standards of their societies.
Look forward to your reply.......
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|2011-08-18 23:25:29 Acharya SNice try. Once again, here I'm exposing horrible abuse against women, and you feel the need to abuse me, a woman. Thanks for demonstrating your misogynistic training - such demonstrations are very useful for the rest to see what we are up against.
You have demonstrated exactly why I do what I do - which is to criticize religious pathology and to expose atrocity and abuse wherever I encounter it.
As concerns solutions, it's quite simple: Instead of residing in utter caveman ignorance with intolerant and misogynistic manmade cults that are the basis of atrocities globally - and that cause people like you to write hate speech to others you don't even know - how about we all grow up, take responsibility for ourselves, and treat each other with respect and dignity, as divine beings of our own right? Ever think of that?
As I have stated repeatedly, I critique IDEOLOGIES THAT CAUSE PEOPLE TO MISTREAT OTHERS. These ideologies, including and especially the Abrahamic cults of Judaism, Christianity and Islam, dictate that humans beings are "born in sin" pieces of crap or otherwise wretches and that they must submit to a giant male overlord in the sky.
I reject this human abuse, as I reject your personal attacks on me for exposing the blatant woman abuse of this particular manmade cult, but, again, thanks for the example of how the defense of an unfeeling and inanimate ideology makes you derogate living breathing human beings whom you don't even know.
"Is it secularism where women are still treated as objects of mens desires, were prostitution is considered legal as a woman has the right to choose her path, were pornography is celebrated as a 'freedom', were so called average women are going under the knife in an attempt to beautify themselves according to the standards of their societies."
What utter nonsense you are learning from your anti-infidel programming. It's because of violent and sexually uncontrolled MEN that women suffer, including and especially those who have created male-dominant and misogynistic cults like the one exposed here, both from its "holy text" and from the mouths of its spokesmen.
Again, you show no concern whatsoever about the misogynistic koranic verses or the heinous sexism and perversion coming out of the mouths of these spokesmen - you are only interested in pointing fingers elsewhere, a fallacy called "tu quoque" widely used by Muslim apologists. As is the tactic of insulting others with personal and disrespectful remarks.
Here are the stages of Muslim apologetics:
1. Denial
2. Deflection
3. Insults
4. Violence
Here's a link on How to Debate a Muslim.
Cheers.
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|2011-08-18 18:28:33 mohammad - reasonperhaps the reason why christianity is brought up, or any other religion for that matter, in these types of discussions, is that at the end of the day we are talking about the human condition, all humans are capable of the same highs and lows.
In the west, nakedness and other freedoms are celebrated, whereas a woman dressed conservatively is considered oppressive. In the east however, the opposite can be said to be true.
we are dealing with the human condition.......
such situations need to be looked at from a balanced point of view, introducing any type of extremism into such topics will only result in a solution which is just as extreme, but on the opposite side of the spectrum
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|2011-08-18 17:57:54 Ron - Unlikely to be published due to political incorrecFor a while I honestly thought this was a site to have open honest dialogue. Possibly to find meeting points and the good and the bad of the various options open to people in the different religions and cultures. The world is seldom black or white. It seems this site is more about go along with the agenda.
The moderator of this site says she does not believe in isms.
Ever heard of feminism or socialism.
Slowly and inexorably the Western world is failing into "modern" socialist feminist states.
The moderator talks about the right to divorce which I fully agree with. However my definition is to take your half and be on your merry. Obviously that is not the prevailing thought in socialist feminist societies. It's easy to bail out when you get it all and 20 years of enforced payments on top.
Islam is by no means a perfect system but in my estimation based on having visited some Arab countries and much reading it is the only counterbalance to the slow, inexorable world wide march of socialism and feminism. It is the last stand against this living hell.
Can anybody explain to me why those two systems always sleep together? I'd really like to know.
When men travel in conservative Arab countries they have to cover their shoulders and legs. This is not a man-woman thing. Maybe it's about enforced modesty or maybe they don't want all our illicit sex as a result of public drunken skin shows. In the big karmic scheme of things is this really that bad?
Injustice will never stand.
If you don’t stand for justice for all, than you do not stand for it at all.
Both Islam and socialist feminism are unjust in their own ways. Maybe it’s how we use them as tools or weapons. I live near the crime, murder capital of Canada and my biggest risk is not getting cleaned out on the street. It is the risk of getting cleaned out by a woman I would choose to live with. Islam is spreading even into Northern Canada and I suspect it will become a dominant force in years to come. Even though I am Gnostic in my beliefs I would politically support Sharia because it would counterbalance the unjust laws of our society. That is an idea that should cause people who are rabidly feminist and socialist to stop and ponder. Maybe they should stop pushing their unjust advantage and reconsider their options.
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|2011-08-18 23:02:13 Acharya S"Even though I am Gnostic in my beliefs I would politically support Sharia because it would counterbalance the unjust laws of our society. "
A "Gnostic" means someone who knows, but anyone who would say such an asinine thing certainly does NOT know.
I don't give a fig for "feminism" or "socialism." THIS post is about institutionalized misogyny and sexism, based on the Islamic sacred text, the Koran.
You apparently have no concern whatsoever about all the heinous woman-abuse in Islam, as explicated upon by these Muslim spokesmen, but are instead interested in making repugnant remarks enabling the imposition of the most heinous religious system upon us against our will.
Sharia law includes the following, which you are so happily promoting. Anyone who knowingly promotes such heinous mistreatment of others is frankly grotesque.
Beheadings
Stonings
Hangings
Beatings
Bombings
Limb amputations
Slavery
Women enslavement
Sex slavery and rape
Misogyny and sexism
Segregation of the sexes
Child marriage and rape
Genital mutilation
Censorship
Etc., ad nauseam
Do not bother to post here again, as I am not interested in airing the views of someone who would support such evil for even one minute.
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|2011-08-19 08:55:56 Sana - My RightsDear Acharya 8
I am a 23 year old Muslim girl. If you pity me, kindly check these links below:
http://www.womeninislam.ws/en/women-right-islam_equality-men-women.asp x
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pvi-g88d5XI
Feel free to ask anything.
Regards
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|2011-08-19 17:36:56 Acharya SI don't "pity" you, except that if you think Islam gives you "rights" as a woman, you are clearly lacking any perspective as to what "rights" really constitute.
You have also apparently not paid attention to anything in this blog post, which clearly demonstrates that, according to the Koran/Islam, women are inferior and need to be repressed. In fact, much of Islamic/sharia law seems to be based on oppressing women.
You are also evidently blinded to the world around, as one look at the status of women in many Muslim-dominant countries will show precisely this blatant oppression. It does these suffering women a tremendous disservice for anyone to be justifying, ignoring or enabling their abuse by misrepresenting Islam's patent misogyny.
Here's another link spelling out exactly what "rights" women have under Islamic law:
Women's Rights in Islam
All the apologizing, handwaving dismissals, distractions elsewhere, etc., will not change the fact that Islam is misogynistic to the nth degree and that the rise of patriarchal religion has been terrible for women, period.
If you knew what REAL RIGHTS you have lost with this rise of intolerant monotheistic male-dominant cults, you would be very angry and disgusted. Try reading this book:
Man Made God
Good luck.
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|2011-08-19 15:26:30 Hypathia - Three Blind Mice>>A boy-goy after nine years and one day old, and a girl after three years and one day old, are considered filthy.
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|2012-06-03 23:35:14 Toshif Shaik - Toshif Shaik :-Dear Mr.Acharya ,,
There is a lot of talk about Islam and the way it treats its women. If I began on the unprecedented rights that Islam gave to women, I would need a lot more than just a post to do that justice. However, the focus here and in a lot of other places these days is on the declaration of a German judge who recently acquitted a Muslim man for beating his wife, citing verses of the Quran in his defense. Expectedly, there has been quite a furore about this.
Does the Quran really condone wife beating? It has become more of a norm to judge things without their context. “Lame” you may say. But I say, context is everything.
I would like to quote a very revealing email I received from a member from a google group that I subscribe to. A debate was struck in the group and Brother Mubeen more than quelled it with a very accurate, very logical and authentic explanation to the whole issue.
Here’s an excerpt:
…”Beat your wife” is a phrase that doesn’t go down too well with me either (and you can check with my wife on that).
But then, yes, there is (only) a (single) reference to beating one’s wife in the Qur’an, and males have conveniently abused it by twisting it out of context to justify their actions that have no place in Islam.
Let us read the ayat where it appears. The translation is by Yusuf Ali, and I quote…
“Men are the protectors and maintainers of women, because Allah has given the one more (strength) than the other, and because they support them from their means. Therefore the righteous women are devoutly obedient, and guard in (the husband’s) absence what Allah would have them guard. As to those women on whose part ye fear disloyalty and ill-conduct, admonish them (first), (Next), refuse to share their beds, (And last) beat them (lightly); but if they return to obedience, seek not against them Means (of annoyance): For Allah is Most High, great (above you all).” Surah Nisa, Chapter 4, Verse 34.
Let us read it carefully. The only reference to beating your wife comes in this verse, and the reasons are clearly defined – disloyalty and ill-conduct. Not for half-cooked food, or for speaking her mind, or for falling prey to his incomprehensible suspicions. And certainly not for demanding a humane treatment in marriage for the rest of her life… Only for disloyalty and ill-conduct, period.
And the routes to use are also made absolutely clear – first, admonish them; then refuse to share a bed, and then if that does not help, then beat them lightly. Please dwell on a key word – lightly.
Many scholars have written a lot about this. And the clear instructions from them are -
1. A man has no liberty to hit his wife for any small reason.
2. Beating your wife is permissible only in the most extreme circumstances (disloyalty and ill-conduct), and only after all other possible means are exhausted. This could include staying away from them, explaining to them, getting one elder from each side of the family to intermediate, admonishing them etc.etc.
3. And even on beating, I refer back to the key word – lightly. Scholars have interpreted this to mean that a man cannot hit his wife on her face – no stinging slaps. He cannot hit her with any instrument that would cause her extreme pain, nor can he hit her so hard that it leaves marks behind. So there! It implies that all that a man can do – after all other means are exhausted – is a light beating that would cause embarrassment to make her change her ways. He is definitely not allowed to take out his frustrations on the human punching punching bag conveniently available to him, and then justify his actions by pointing to religion. By doing this, we men are just opening up the doors of Hell for ourselves.
In this context, let me also mention that while there is only one reference here about ‘beating your wife’, this ayat starts by saying “Men are the protectors and maintainers of women…”
And there are numerous other verses in various ayats about the rights of women in Islam, their ownership of property being their own, and the way they ought to be treated, the respect that men must give them et al. To quote just one ayat, again from the same chapter…
“O ye who believe! Ye are forbidden to inherit women against their will. Nor should ye treat them with harshness, that ye may Take away part of the dower ye have given them,-except where they have been guilty of open lewdness; on the contrary live with them on a footing of kindness and equity. If ye take a dislike to them it may be that ye dislike a thing, and Allah brings about through it a great deal of good.” Surah Nisa, Chapter 4, Verse 34.
How many men read this line, and live it…“on the contrary live with them on a footing of kindness and equity”. Please note the “On the Contrary”.
The last line is also particularly of importance, “If ye take a dislike to them it may be that ye dislike a thing, and Allah brings about through it a great deal of good.”, which tells a man that he is not at freedom to divorce his wife giving the excuse that he does not like her.
I would recommend reading Chapter 4 (Surah Nisa – meaning Woman in Arabic) in detail with translation to all who want to understand the rights and duties of women in Islam…”
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|2012-09-27 17:10:02 jgeorgia2000 - Equality of womenAll of the Muslim comments are mostly true but they forget one very important point . The western (non Arabic/Muslim) generations progressed to our present day freedoms for all women. The Muslims have, unfortunately, remained stuck in the barbaric middle ages. Therefore the assumption that the Koran is literally used today to subjugate and abuse women is an ignorant, and male self-serving agenda. From other comments and knowledge of Islam the effect of not allowing women to be educated is very important to keep this archaic culture alive. Just as the printing of the Bible took the interpretations out of the preview of Monks only, the education of women and their reading of the Koran would change the barbaric tradition!!
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|2012-06-05 08:31:39 jo - religion vs womeni have read the parts you have posted in the beginning and they are all true except that you have read them in English obviously.. the thing is that you do not read arabic and if you did you'd be more disgusted...
the field part is almost completely true excpect the idea of approaching them was sexual :S the most disturbing part for me...
and you have to replace every "wed" word with the "f" word because that was the word in arabic which only arabs can understand and still beautify in front of those who are victims of translation which is driving me crazy to see all those poor educated foriegn women from US and Europe convert to this ridiculous religion....
But unfortunately all religions have serious anger towards women which i have also read in the bible in both languages, like the fact that she is not to be speaking in church because her voice is annoying... and the fact that i had to hear the priest say that the man is head of the woman... why is god so hateful against women in religion? I think simply because the source of all religions is the same... men!!!
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|2012-07-13 02:23:11 Islama Pajama - Islam = misogynisticNo idea how you can explain away how Islam treats women as second class animals
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|2012-07-20 22:27:12 Anonymous - Makes me sickWhy would a good god want women to be beaten knocks me sick!! God made men n women equal we dont live in olden times we live in 2012 were men and women are equal! Muslim women should not tolerate this and therefore your faith is through fear not love for your god, you dont have free will!
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|2012-11-20 18:40:42 Anonymous - Answer.Peace.
You've answered all the true guidance of the Quran.
"Why would god want Women beaten? You feel sick about this statement? You should. Because the truth is that the Quran doesn't say to "BEAT" women. It's translations by some, and the misunderstanding of others, including those of the understanding of the Arabic language. But if you examine these words being translated for the Arabic to other languages, you will see for yourself the Arabic word in it's root meaning, and consistency of it use in the Quran, will make clear to All Women abused by this misunderstanding that the word revealed in the Quran is not to be translated as "Hit, Beat, Scourge, Softly Touched, with Tooth Brushes, etc. All these translation are intentionally deceiving the masses, causing the abuse in Women, and Horrible, mis-guided Men.
"God made women equal to men". This is true, and it's in the Quran. Unfortunately, once again, certain people are using the to justify their ignorance instead of using it for what it's truly revealing, which is that We are all equal in the sight of Allah, and this is in the Quran.
"Muslim women should not tolerate this", again you've told the truth. Not only muslim women but any woman. And this thought you have is also clearly in the Quran.
"Therefore your faith is through fear not love for your god", and this is also the truth. Faith in the teaching from the Quran, is not fear. It's to ponder and to learn, to come to the understanding, and fear is not a requirement at all. But if these are fearing, then your point made of "not love for your god", is absolutely correct.
Since the Quran clearly teaches the LOVE for Creation, one who is in the spirit of LOVE of self, is truly not Fearful, and should therefore take control of these points made against them, being in that true sense of awareness, and truly pondering.
In conclusion, I appreciate you pondering over these important matters. I thought the same way for a long time until one day, I took a Quran just to intentionally find fault. But after carefully studying and still do, I've come to know for sure that what you've described here is Truth, and that the Quran supports your understanding and analysis on these matters.
It's not the Quran that's wrong. It's not Islam that wrong. Those are not it's teachings. It's individuals that indulge in the wrong on purpose to control the masses, then try to justify their ignorance with in this case, The Quran.
It's like people who smoke that can read a pack of cigarettes stating, "Smoking is Bad for your Health", but still smoke just because they like the feeling.
If people were to take heed to the Surgeon General's warning on those cigarettes pack, they wouldn't smoke at all. But some people who do smoke, even though they know the truth about this matter on smoking, still indulge just for the sake of doing it, as they see fit, for the moment, etc. Not because the pack of cigarettes told them to smoke, but because it's what the masses are doing, classified as the "norm", or it's okay since it's "Legalized".
Blessings To You and yours.
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|2013-02-14 12:45:10 WilliamMuslims when cornered with facts and reference from Qura'an start giving round and round answers. When they are caught they start giving long answers like sermons. This 'Taqqiya' (Deception) they use to mislead unassuming & gullible people.
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|2012-08-12 18:46:51 AnonymousKeep up the good work, someone has to expose religion for what it is, an ugly system of control.
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|2012-09-13 18:34:06 Ben - What a pack off idiots!!!This makes me sick!! Only when women become empowered by education and not brain washed by silly men can this ridiculous book of stupid laws be shown for the ridiculousness that it is!!
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|2012-09-22 01:18:54 sharonALL MUSLIM WOMEN AND GET TOGETHER AND BEAT MEN UP.
GANG UP AGAINST MEN IN YOUR MUSLIM COUNTRIES AND BEAT MEN UP AND SEE HOW THEY LIKE IT IF SOMEONE TREATED THEM LIKE THAT!!!!
MUSLIM MEN WOULD NOT LIKE IT IF SOMEONE BEAT THEM UP. TREAT OTHERS HOW YOU LIKE TO BE TREATED YOURSELF.
YOU DO NOT BEAT ANYONE INCLUDING WOMEN AND CHILDREN, MEN. NO ONE DESERVE TO BE BEAT UP BY ANYONE ELSE ON THIS PLANET.
YOU MUSLIM MEN CAN MAKE THE DECISON NOT TO BEAT WOMEN AND BE VIOLENT TOWARDS WOMEN. MUSLIM MEN GROW UP!!!!!!!!
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|2012-10-04 07:57:54 HappyHappy as Larry, I'm an atheist and I treat people as I expect to be treated and don't need a god or castle in the sky to be a good person. Just a thought, if there was a god would he not have crushed all the pretenders by now instead of letting this world suffer at the hands of delusional god makers!!!!!!
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|2012-12-05 08:37:08 Mohamed - MisinterpretationAs usual The non believers turn and twist the meanings of not only theQuran but many times even their own religious books.
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|2012-12-05 16:40:43 Acharya SWhat utter nonsense and calumny. It is not we "non believers" who are misinterpreting twisting anything. It's the Muslim fanatics who are following these scriptures literally and using them to abuse and enslave women, which we can all see with our own two eyes.
All you have done is to prove the reasons why we are complaining about these scriptures, as you attempt to abuse and vilify us "filthy kuffar" by claiming it is WE who are the problem here.
Thanks for the example of how Islamic fanaticism makes one unreasonable and sets one at odds with the rest of humanity. You just proved our point.
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|2012-12-23 14:54:40 AnonymousOh wow Archana
You're abusing all the men on here.
And almost all your staements are false... I have Indian and Arab ethnicity and I am Muslim and nevre have i felt that my muslim famil or relatives discriminate me I am given as much freedom as any other 15 year old girl.
We are not oppressed... There are reasons why the Quran says so and you must'nt judge a religion by your little knowledge
Oh yea my best friends father who was hindu always abused his wife
By hating on a religion makes you a terrorist
people like you are the reason why this world cant live in peace
people like you are the reason why india and pakistan are so f**ked up
people like you are the reason why islam is degraded
People like you are the reason why the life on earth should end
people like you are the reason why hinduism is losing respect in my ees
people like you are the reason why i lost hope in humanity
Oh if your culture is so biased why are you moving to countries like UAE?!
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|2012-12-23 13:21:04 Acharya SThank you for your fallacious defense, character assassination and vile hatred by claiming that what I am conveying is mendacious and by directing the rest of your vicious bilge towards my person. You do not know me in the least, but you make the most disgraceful characterizations of me and my work.
It is because of such dishonesty and personally abusive mentality that we are in such a poor state globally, with religious fanatics bombing and killing, dividing humanity into believers and subhumans, setting themselves apart from and above the rest of mankind. In your hate speech against my person, your behavior is shameful. One could easily make such a list of hateful comments directed back at you as the source of all the world's problems.
"Hating" or criticizing an ideology that calls for the death of me and my loved ones, along with the enslavement of my gender, makes me a "terrorist?" This statement is completely irrational and, frankly, disgusting. It is the mark of a wise, courageous and empathetic person to defend innocent individuals against abusive ideologies, including and especially religious fanaticism, which has led to the torture, rape and deaths of hundreds of millions, if not billions, worldwide for the past several thousand years.
People like me are the reason Islam is degraded? An utterly absurd notion, as I have never practiced Islam and am responsible for none of it, including the some 270 million people slaughtered in its name. I have nothing whatsoever to do with India or Pakistan - your remarks are frankly completely irrational and ridiculous.
Your naive and hostile defense ultimately alters nothing I have stated here but, unfortunately, verifies what I am saying. You acknowledge nothing about the abuse found in the Koran that is externalized all over the world, as exemplified in the numerous videos here straight from Muslim authorities themselves. You show no concern for the hundreds of millions of women who have suffered globally but especially in Muslim countries. Instead, you feel the need to play victim and abuse me personally with ludicrous character assassination.
In the meantime, women continue to be abused by Koranic and biblical verses, including not only general sexism and misogyny but also the most heinous physical and psychological debasement imaginable.
Most assuredly, I personally am not moving to countries like the UAE, where girls like you enjoy relative freedom. On the contrary, I will likely never set foot in such a female-oppressive land, as I do not wish to be abused and enslaved. But why not speak of Saudi Arabia, Yemen, Pakistan, Somalia and Afghanistan, where life for most women is a living hell? Your comments here based on your own relatively easy experience, while ignoring the plight of Muslim females elsewhere, are beyond disingenuous.
You are a young woman who has barely been alive for any significant length of time, and you clearly have little experience with or knowledge with the world at large. Your experience and knowledge are limited and shallow, and you are completely ignoring the horrible suffering of Muslim women worldwide, based on the quotes from the Koran I have provided here - the very proof of what I am saying, but which you are blithely dismissing while spewing hate speech at my person.
All one needs to do, however, is to read these posts and comments, and take a long, hard look at the world and history with one's eyes wide open and without such hatred in one's heart as you are carrying. Again, your very comments here hating on my person simply because I dare to expose the blatant, ongoing and virulent abuse of women under Islam exemplify the OP.
Let us hope to move beyond such divisiveness and hatred, which are the hallmarks of religious fanaticism. Abusing an individual you do not even know over a religious ideology is one of the biggest problems on this planet, leading to the deaths of hundreds of millions of innocent people.
I wish you luck.
Cheers.
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|2013-02-19 19:23:25 Richard - You can tell a bigot, but you can't tell them much"People like you"| Is a term frequently used by Bigots.
Odd that a 15 year old girl could get this formula so correct.
1. Denial - We are not oppressed.
2. Deflection -you must'nt judge
3. Insults - by your little knowledge
4. Violence - the reason why the life on earth should end
Bigotry may be based on real or perceived characteristics, including age, disability, dissension from popular opinions, socioeconomic status, ethnicity, gender identity, language, nationality, political alignment, race, region, religious or spiritual belief, sex, or sexual orientation. Bigotry is sometimes developed into an ideology or world view.
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|2012-12-23 20:02:02 Anonymous - AnonymousAs it was mentioned before Islam bettered the condition of women. Yes, but these were different, archaic times. In modern times, the laws of Sharia represent several steps backwards.
Now women are, at very best, dealing with social pressure within Muslim communities because they need to conform to the role Islam has set for them. They view themselves as sexual objects who are to withdraw from the public eye. That's not to mention the oppression and violence which are partially permitted by the Sharia.
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|2013-01-11 14:13:45 Anonymous - Correct yourself firstTo owner of this subject: the muslim guy made good comments & good points, but you didn't answer him yet. you just talked about his behavior, still waiting for an answer to the muslim guy.. but i'm sure you don't have an answer.
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|2013-01-11 19:08:34 ASWhat "muslim guy" would that be? You have not specified. I have spent many hours answering all the "muslim guys" here and elsewhere, so your contentions are simply false.
In the meantime, perhaps you should read the original post here - can you explain why the Koran contains so much hate speech against women? Why are you not disturbed by the hatred, bigotry and calls to violence against women? Why instead do you make false claims about me for exposing this hatred and bigotry?
Correct yourself please, and answer the above questions.
But I'm sure you don't have an answer.
In the meantime, while you waste my time with such falsehoods, women are suffering under Islamic domination. But you have no concern about that fact, obviously.
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|2013-03-06 01:04:00 Anonymouslets put all those quran verses in reality ,
1) menstrual periods .one->well whats wrong with this ?,this verse is for woman in period and to knowledge man that woman is in difficult suitation during its period so dont do intercource (its clear)
2)Women are your fields one->it is kind of cute verse,because if u ask a farmer that how he see his field or how he treat its field then his answer will be ,in sweets words showing sweetness bw men and his wife
3)Men have authority over women because God has made man superior because he feed her ,one->well in this verse ALLAH is savingg that man is MADE superior (EMPHASIZE ON--> MADE) means in any organizaton there are levels to make things systematical like in sports u have caption,sub caption or u create some one who is responsible to control things ,like in marriage woman always seek help in sens of protection to not to get harass by others or in difficult situations (accept this i can proof u
) and in 2nd part ,think if your wife stole money or say bad to your mother or father or talk to those people whom u hate ,well u will argue with her ask her why and if she not licene to u then u will nnot going to talk to each other, well woman is with small heart, she is sensitive and she will ask u sorry or ok next time i will not do, to keep relation going on , but if she do again u HIT her-> well what u think of hitting a girl well if u have girl child and she is doing bad thng then how u will bunish her with small hitting with ur hand this is what said HIT HER, and remember those muslims who beat there woman just to show there superiority are uneducated (AS ALL OF U LOOK EDUCATED so how u will going to punish ur girl child if she stole money or do bad thing what and how u will going to do )?
all the other verse are related with that marry to two ,4 girls if u can now telling u some logic that woman are more then man in this world
and what is wrong to have more then one wife
woman get confuse quickly IN most cases or get scared in most cases
so having two woman thay can remember my mutual understanding and giving confident to each other
(if u have mercedes and give to such a person who dont know how to drive car propery then ur mercedes will meet accident) similary quran is a system a good system to live (it relates ur actions and reaction and physiology that how man and woman muslim and nonmuslim react to different reaction and also give solutions to these) but if u us it badly it will har u
and who ever post these verses should get full details from islamic scholars to realy see is islam is wrte or wrong like if u want to know about sum thing or subject then u goo to teachers to know what is written in it
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|2013-03-07 23:34:51 ASI'm sorry, but your whole message is disgusting. You are making light of the intense bigotry, hatred and violence directed at women because of foul "scriptures" written by desert troglodytes.
Your first question about what is wrong with isolating menstruating women, as if they are vile filth, simply reflects a poor character and very ignorant mind. This hatred of menstruating women dates back thousands of years and serves as a way to denigrate women overall and keep them powerless.
As concerns your suggestion that treating women as "fields" in which men can enter - i.e., RAPE - anytime they wish is "cute" is simply depraved.
Men are not superior to women, and if a text says that, then it is worse than worthless and should be thrown in the trash.
You are barely literate, immoral and not very bright, yet you feel the need to lecture others as if you are a superior being. As should be obvious, we are already going to Islamic sources for our knowledge about Islam, and we can see that it is completely FALSE. You are simply brainwashed.
What a waste of time. In the meantime, women are suffering horribly because of these shameful "scriptures" and immoral individuals who defend them.
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|2013-03-09 12:20:18 hcdeboer - NatureIt's clear what Moh and Jeez and other PEOPLE had to say about women in the past and present day people are so anxious to believe, but what does GOD itself has to say about it. God's word is in NATURE and looking at nature reveals us the TRUTH (people just have opinions).
So here is my opinion.
What nature tells us, we look at the scientific evidence. So here is a picture of what nature makes people WOMEN (the X chromosome) and what makes people MEN (the Y chromosome).
(the picture also shows you WHY we call it X and Y chromosomes)
A woman has 2 X-chromosomes, while a man has an X and a Y chromosome. The Y-chromosome makes people male.
And for the person that thinks that Islam was a good thing for women 1500 years ago - maybe, with all the religious ideas in those days, but we don't live in 500 AD and we have a better solution now, called EQUALITY.
BTW, if you care to go back thousands of years further, you will find that once WOMEN were worshipped and the main god was a GODDESS.
The males of our species must have had a gigantic inferiority complex to come up with the ridiculous misogynist religions.
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|2013-03-21 18:31:38 Anonymous - think about thisthe quotes you have here are all from Quran, that's true. But I find it unfair and sad that only the oppressive quotes are presented. You are probably all well educated people and you should understand that truth is a grey tone and thus Quran is not either good or bad book. Quran says a lot of good about women too, but the writer of this post didn't present those ayat, maybe because it contradicts with the image of Islam he/she wants to convey to the readers. It's as narrow minded and propagandistic internet journalism as the followining website: http://www.islamswomen.com/articles/women_in_quran_and_sunnah.php As you can see, this article has chosen positive quotes about women. In summary, both articles, this and the one I linked, are as righteous, because the quotes they have are all true. The point is, what kind of image the writer wants readers to get.
Myself, I have no opinion of the treatment of women in Islamic dogma, because most of the horrible deeds done to women are committed because of tradition and modern political islamization, not because of the dogmas.
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|2013-03-21 21:25:12 ASThere is nothing "narrowminded" about providing the Islamic doctrine that is causing horrible misogyny worldwide, including unbelievable abuse of women in numerous countries like Pakistan, Afghanistan, Yemen, Saudi Arabia, Iran, Egypt and so on.
It's disturbing that you are more concerned with our exposure of why female abuse is rampant in the Muslim world than you are about the abuse itself. If you have a problem with the Muslim men who are using these Koranic verses in order to abuse women, then you should try to stop them, rather than complaining about us.
In the meantime, none of the "feel-good" verses you are proposing have done anything to prevent the widespread abuse of women in Muslim-dominant areas. Your own narrowmindedness in defending this misogynistic ideology and trying to deflect off it is only aiding and abetting the abuse of women and girls globally.
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|2013-05-13 11:28:40 Anonymousthe quranic sayings have been taken out of context like for example men will inherit 2 times as much of women that is true BUT what the women inherits she does not have to give to anyone (no, not even her children) but it is considered a good deed when she does and what the man inherits he is obligated to support all his family with it should they ask for it (so basically dumbed down that means a man has to support his family a women doesnt)
Also i know in some countries honour killings and mistreatment against women happens but that is culture not religion 'there is no compulsion in religion)
I would also like to say that from all my life i have never seen mistreatment against women (in the name of islam) my father, brothers, male relatives,family friends have never laid a hand on their wives.
"the women was not created from the mans feet to be walked on nor his head to be superior over but from his ribs as his equal"
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|2013-05-14 00:49:31 ASBlah, blah, blah. The excuses are pathetic. The only people taking these verses out of context are MUSLIM FANATICS.
Instead of wasting our time here, please go tell these MUSLIM FANATICS that they are taking the verses out of context when they are using them to bomb, terrorize, mutilate, behead, slaughter, rape and all the rest that they are doing.
I'm sure they will love to hear from you.
Start here:
http://islamreality.wordpress.com
The fact is that hundreds of millions of Muslims are LIVING according to these verses, that sharia law DOES say women are worth one-half as much as men, and so on.
Your apologies ring hollow and are insulting to the intelligence.
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|2013-05-13 11:36:31 Anonymouswhat i don't understand is if islam shows mistreatment of women then why are WOMEN converting to islam? why not just stay in their religion before if whilst searching for islam it said all this mistreatment of women.
because if i wasn't a muslim and i saw this for example i wouldnt want to convert to islam, so please don't take the quran out of context because i know this isnt true (or the whole truth) but someone else will not.
The prophet said after allah and his messages you should love and respect your mother who next? he was asked he said your mother ,who next? your mother who next? your father
Also heaven lies at the feet of your mother. So it doesn't make sense to mistreat them (and women)
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|2013-05-14 00:54:24 ASThe women who convert willingly to Islam are damaged goods, like the crazy Lauren Booth.
Islam is welcome to them.
In the meantime, sane women like Ayaan Hirsi Ali are FLEEING Islam.
Again, your apologies ring hollow, as Islam is the most misogynistic ideology ever devised by the human mind, and we who are not blind can see it with our own eyes.
Please feel free to tell these Muslim spokesmen that you disagree with their abusive and oppressive ideas about women:
http://islamreality.wordpress.com
A few platitudes supposedly by Mohammed will not serve to undue the past 1,400 years of women-terrorizing by Islam.
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|2013-05-21 03:10:20 Anonymous - You are all horribly delusional and unable to thinIt is really utterly simple: Man created god, gods, other beings because his development led him to do this; it was perfectly acceptable and natural to believe, to accept and to revere these fairy tale ideas back then and even as far as the latter parts of the 20th century BUT .... BUT we are now progressing at an exponential rate and have the ability to cross-examine, to READ, to research and NOT to simply accept whatever our parents, teachers, forefathers and religious zealots claim we must do or else face terrible punishment and reprisals .... seriously, dispense with ALL religious nonsense, examine the FACTS and uuterly reject any kind of silly wish-thinking and learn to get along as humans bonded together by species and not race, creed, colour and silly religious bullsh*t. You are all deluded for STILL believing all this claptrap.
Just STOP!
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|2013-05-22 07:14:24 Anonymousif you want to write against it then you ought to have balls to listen to the counter debate @ WHO EVER WROTE THIS BULL-sh*t... how about we compare religions..... go learn about all faiths in detail n i mean IN DETAIL... you don't know about sh*t and you want to talk about a religion??? sorry please educate yourrself before commenting... peace!!
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|2013-05-23 15:02:57 ASTo whom are you are speaking with your angry, hostile and insulting remarks?
If you are attacking us for exposing the misogyny of Islam, you are serving to prove our point that Islam creates angry, hateful and nasty people.
In the meantime, what we've written here about Islam and women is true. There is no "counter debate." The hatred and oppression of women as promulgated by Islam is evident to anyone with eyes to see.
You are only fooling yourself, while trying through hate speech to bludgeon us into your perspective, which is angry and hostile.
Thanks again for the example, but no thanks.
Oh, and by the way, we compare religions here all the time, so that little finger-pointing elsewhere debate tactic won't work.
Here are the tactics of Muslim apologists:
1. Denial
2. Deflection
3. Insults
4. Threats
5. Violence
You are up to no. 3.
Time to grow a conscience and stop being so dishonest about Islam, without denial, deflection, insults, threats and violence - all of these latter merely serve to prove our points here.
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|2013-06-10 12:00:13 AnonymousAll right people, one step at a time.
Circular reasoning: "The Koran is the word of Allah because that is stated in the Koran" This tells us nothing. "Allah is kind, merciful and benevolent according to the Koran" Still tells us nothing.
Looking at the facts presented in this illuminating article reveals that women in Islam have been mistreated horribly. On the other hand, all religion is really nothing but drivel.
I personally believe that there has been just a bit too much anger and biased views in this ongoing argument for the civilization that any supposed God (which I believe to be non-existant) might have "prepared" us for. Looking back at all the horrors that mankind has unleashed through the millennium, for me, it really is to much to think that we are meant to be "stewards of the Earth", as some ridiculous deity so kindly points out.
Peace.
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Generally speaking, they only seem to get their knowledge of their own scripture from others--usually from the imam and somewhat domineering parents. For instance, one 30 year old Muslim of my acquantance didn't dare eat duck eggs because he didn't know if they were haram or halal, despite the fact that he ate chicken eggs. On being asked, his dad informed him--with a whack--that were were haram, though they in fact are not. I could recount more, but you get the idea.
Ironically, I lent a copy of Dawood's Quran to my brother. The subsequent surprise amongst his Muslim friends when they found him reading it was (apparently) similar to meeting a pig talking. None of them had read it, and one of them even borrowed it, much to his mum's delight. His mum even unbent enough to teach the gorah (meaning "whitey", i.e. anybody not as well tanned as themselves) traditional pakistani cooking.
Suffice it to say, if translations of the Quran in their native languages could be encouraged, perhaps Islam might go through its own Reformation. That's a thought, it might be better sending them Qurans rather than Bibles . . .
As for "women's matters", the Quran offers much material for self-appointed interpreters to press their iniquitous views on others. This has to be intelligently opposed.