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PostPosted: Mon Apr 14, 2008 6:50 am 
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Tat Tvam Asi wrote:
let's go ahead and knock out this delusion once and for all Nick.

What do you know that I do not know?


I am not saying that you do not know, for a start because as far as I'm aware knowing is not so much to do with it. I am saying that you are not really involved, as far as I can make out. You are not affected by the material. You analyse it with your mind, but it does not seem to touch you.

Quote:
The most that you can possibly "know" Nick, is that you are the transcendent (unknown). You are that which you seek to know but can not know because it transcends all of the categories of thought and the mind. You are that. "Thou Art That"


That you can make a statement like this and apparently believe it is accurate demonstrates even more to me that you are not immersed in mysticism. You are walking around the swimming pools making pretty maps of what it must be like to swim. This is totally how you come across to me. Such and such a writer said such and such a thing. Did it not occur to you that the maps are really nothing to do with it?

Quote:
Not only do I know that I am the non-dual transcendent mystery of existence incarnate, but I know that you and everyone and everything in the world, the universe, and the eternal beyond are the non-dual transcendent incarnate as well. I know that reality is one inseparable inter-connectivity grounded in deep mystery.


Yes, yes, thoughts arise but so what?

Quote:
You've already agreed that the term MYSTERY is good metaphor for the non-dual transcendent.

A is you and X is the mystery, and A=X.


You're living in a world of formulas. Why not examine your emotional reactions in this dialogue, for example? Mysticism is finally very little to do with mind and far more to do with feelings. For me, living communally with a heap of sannyasins all of us constantly in bucketloads of feelings, it is very easy to spot when someone is simply relating to the world through conceptual maps their mind has created. Why not write about your feelings more?

Nick

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"Every plant, which my heavenly Father hath not planted, shall be rooted up." - Matthew 15


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 14, 2008 6:52 am 
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Mriana wrote:
Listening to it is not what I meant. I'm talking about your arrogance in thinking you know it all and in this case you know what part of Tat's thinking is wrong. Sorry, but you aren't a psychologist or a theologian, nor do you know it all. BTW, you are hardly Socrates.


Socrates was hardly Socrates. I don't know exactly where Tat is coming from but I know I've heard these wannabe mystics who are totally stuck in their heads a million times, well a thousand at least. Literally everything he puts out is to me consistent with that.

OK, OK, you say you're intellectuals. Fair enough. I am not. I take a position.

Nick

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"So the ancients considered the sun as the principle symbol of deity. No ancient person of wisdom or insight ever thought of the sun as that being, but rather the mirror of it." - Manly P. Hall

"Every plant, which my heavenly Father hath not planted, shall be rooted up." - Matthew 15


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 14, 2008 11:57 am 
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H.P Blavatsky -

"The mystery of the Sun is the grandest perhaps, of all the innumerable mysteries ... It was the “Sun of Initiation” that was meant, in its triple form—two of which are the “Day-Sun” and the “Night-Sun.” The Solar Trinity is universal. All the temples in Antiquity were invariably made to face the Sun, their portals to open to the East. See the old temples of Memphis and Baalbec, the Pyramids of the Old and of the New.

"The last of the Solar Priests in Europe was the Imperial Initiate, Julian, now called the Apostate.* He tried to benefit the world. * Julian died for the same crime as Socrates. Both divulged a portion of the solar mystery, the heliocentric system being only a part of what was given during Initiation

"“There are three in one,” he said of the Sun—the central Sun* being a precaution of Nature: the first is the universal cause of all, Sovereign Good and perfection; the Second Power is paramount Intelligence, having dominion over all reasonable beings, @,D@4H; the third is the visible Sun. The pure energy of solar intelligence proceeds from the luminous seat occupied by our Sun in the centre of heaven, that pure energy being the Logos of our system; the “Mysterious Word-Spirit produces all through the Sun, and never operates through any other medium,” says Hermes Trismegistus. “For it is in the Sun, more than in any other heavenly body that the [unknown] Power placed the seat of its habitation.”

"It is evident that Philolaus referred to the central spiritual Sun, whose beams and effulgence are only mirrored by our central Star, the Sun. This is as clear to the Occultists as it was to the Pythagoreans. As for the profane of pagan antiquity, it was, of course, the physical Sun that was the “highest God”"

http://www.tonh.net/theosofie/hpb_cw_on ... ph_057.htm

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The "Jesus Christ" of the New Testament is a fictional composite of characters, real and mythical. A composite of multiple "people" is no one.

The celestial Origins of Religious Belief
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Jesus: Hebrew Human or Mythical Messiah?


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 14, 2008 12:18 pm 
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You see Nick, the Highest God represents the transcendent causation. That which is above Jesus as his Father is the same as that which is above the Sun as the causation of the whole universe.

Jesus and the Sun are the same symbol which is pointing at the unknown mystery cause of universe.

Don't you get it?

Isn't this plainly clear?

When you say that Jesus is much deeper than the Sun, that's only to suggest that the Sun/Jesus points to something transcendent. The deeper meaning of Jesus/Sun traces back to "causation". The Sun/Jesus is metaphorical of something transcendent which is the source, end, and supporting ground of all life and being (causation).

All of this subjectmatter is in the realm of ASTROTHEOLOGY.

You mentioned multiple numerical symbol sets in mysticism earlier, well guess what, you just listened to Hall state that mathematics and astronomy and the observation of the natural world together form the term "astrotheology".

If you refer to any form of Numerology existing in your mystical traditions than you are referring to "astrotheology" when doing it. No matter how many different numerical symbol sets there are is irrelevant, the fact is that if you are using mathematics in any way, shape, or form, you are utilizing "astrotheology" while you're doing it. Astrotheology is not limited to the number 12 of the zodiacal cycle as you seem to think, it's the whole of numerical mathematics which made astronomy and numerology possible.

If you refer to an underlying power of "causation" behind the natural Sun in mysticism, you are referring to "astrotheology". The main point is that the Sun was considered "God's Son" by the ancients and that was made perfectly clear in Zeitgeist right as they were going into the specifics about the Zodiac. Horus and all of the other solar personifications in antiquity, including "Jesus", are all metaphorical symbols that represent the Sun which is also metaphorical of the underlying "mystery causation" of the universe, or "God" if you prefer.

Your whole argument has been an illusion.

Astrotheology is not 10% of the Bible.

It's everything "astronomical", it's everything "numerical" and "mathematical", and it's everything "mystical" in religion.

You appear to be trying to fight astrotheology with astrotheology.

Kind of like a dog chasing it's own tail around and around completely oblivious to the reality of the situation at hand.

_________________
The Jesus Mythicist Creed:
The "Jesus Christ" of the New Testament is a fictional composite of characters, real and mythical. A composite of multiple "people" is no one.

The celestial Origins of Religious Belief
ZG Part 1
Jesus: Hebrew Human or Mythical Messiah?


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 14, 2008 5:29 pm 
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The following are excerpts from texts from the Tomb of Kheruef at Thebes in Egypt.

These texts represent part of the ASTROTHEOLOGICAL religion passionately followed by HUNDREDS OF MILLIONS of Egyptians over thousands of years.

I have to say, 227, the hatred you spew at the ancient religions is simply a form of prejudice and bigotry against the Egyptian culture, for one. Your constant insults reminds me of the Jewish ploy in ripping off the Egyptians, reworking their religion to revolve around the Jews themselves, and then insulting and being derogatory towards the Egyptians. In fact, that's EXACTLY what you've been doing here. "No, no! Don't look at the Pagan religions - those are all crap. Just focus all your attention on and become obsessed with JEWISH religious thought..." i.e., the Bible, Christian apocrypha, the Kabbalah, ad nauseam. You remind me of something out of the Old Testament. Yeah, that's really enlightened and forward thinking.

I'll stick to the originals, thank you, instead of the boring ripoffs. And you can quit with your culturally bigoted baloney and prejudicial Pagan-hatred - I ain't buying it.

The following Egyptian ASTROTHEOLOGICAL texts are from the book Texts from the Amarna Period in Egypt by Dr. William J. Murnane, pp. 58-59.

Quote:
Adoration of Re in the morning[...] in the horizon [...].

Adoration of Amun-[Re], the divine god, beloved one, [...] by [the Good God] Neferkheprure, the Son of Re, Amenhotep IV: "Hail to you, (O) Re, great of appearances [...], beautiful of forms, preeminent in his sanctuary, soulful one (?), most hidden of those who are hidden when he sets; mighty of countenance, who has made all that exists; (O) Horus the Elder, lord of the two conclaves, who is in the bark, repeating appearances, [...]; (O) Re-Khepri, [...] as the solar disck (=Aten); (O) Atum, who is over the Two Horizons, pefect, King of the Gods, who advances his divine image, [great] in valor, effective...

This is from the same tomb of Kheruef at Thebes, called the "Hymn to the Rising Sun."

Quote:
Adoration of Re in the morning [when he rises] in the horizon of heaven by the hereditary prince and count, the favorite of Horus (who is) Lord of the Palace, the steward of the King's Chief Wife, the first royal herald, Kheruef, justified. [He says]: "Hail to you, (O) Re in his rising, Amun in [your beautiful setting]. You shine on your mother's back, appearing [in glory] as king of the Ennead. [Nut makes] a greeting before your face, and Maat embraces you at all times. [You] traverse [the sky], your [heart] being joyful... You cross both your heavens in triumph while your Ennead appears in your following. Your mother Nut enfolds you as you are made to flourish in your place of yesterday."

And here is an excerpt from the "Hymn to the Setting Sun," pp. 60-61.

Quote:
Adoration of Re as he sets in life in the western horizon of heaven by the hereditary prince and count, sole companion who as access to his lord, favorite of Horus (who is) lord of the palace... "Hail to you, master of continuity, Atum, chief of eternity! Now that you have joined with the horizon of heaven, you appear in glory on the western side of Atum, who is in the evening, having come in your power and having no opponent. You have banished clouds and tempest. As you descend into the womb of your mother Naune, your father Nun [makes] greeting and the gods of the western mountain are jubilating. Those who are in the netherworld are joyous when they see their far-striding lord!"

Give me the joy and happiness of the sun-worshipping Egyptians in their hymns to the sun anytime. I see no need for a bigot who mindlessly dismisses their entire culture based on narrow-minded prejudices.

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 15, 2008 5:54 am 
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Tat Tvam Asi wrote:
You see Nick, the Highest God represents the transcendent causation. That which is above Jesus as his Father is the same as that which is above the Sun as the causation of the whole universe.

Jesus and the Sun are the same symbol which is pointing at the unknown mystery cause of universe.

Don't you get it?

Isn't this plainly clear?


You are the central cause of the universe actually, Tat. Had you bothered to look. You are the mystery, and it is this mystery that the universe is calling you to examine....directly. Not through endlessly studying symbol sets and trying to convince yourself they're all the same, but by turning your awareness around and examining who you are. The Kingdom of God is within You, dude. That's a literal statement.

You are trying to convince me that all mysticism is based on solar symbolism. I could argue with you, because I'm used to a myriad other symbols systems, but actually that's fairly pointless because you don't anyway believe what solar symbolism is telling you....You are in darkness now. Physical manifestation is the phase of the solar cycle where the light is hidden. And to find the way out you must turn the focus of your awareness around and look inside. The answers cannot be given to you. You can only unravel your own self through personal examination and keep going deeper and deeper until liberation occurs...if it does.

It is not to endlessly compare all of these different mystical beliefs and interpretations and how this one evolved and became this one, oh except for that bit, or but maybe it's like this one over here. That's not what it's about.

Solar symbolism, polyfigurate number symbolism, isopsephia symbolism, Tarot symbolism, zodiac symbolism, the 32 paths of wisdom, the 10 sephirah of the Etz Cha'im, the 7 chakras, whatever - all of these systems are highly limited in what they can actually achieve. The principle thing they have the possibility of doing, not the only thing but the principle thing, is to convince you of your predicament; to convince you that you need to look elsewhere; to convince you that you need to turn your focus around.

This is why I am saying that Astrotheology is not the basis of mystical Christianity. It, like the other symbol systems present in the text, is merely the prelude. The basis is entirely personal. It's about how you receive the mystical sayings attributed to Jesus, because in trying to unravel a genuine mystery, you discover more about who you are.

Nick

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"So the ancients considered the sun as the principle symbol of deity. No ancient person of wisdom or insight ever thought of the sun as that being, but rather the mirror of it." - Manly P. Hall

"Every plant, which my heavenly Father hath not planted, shall be rooted up." - Matthew 15


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 15, 2008 6:10 am 
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Freethinkaluva22 wrote:
Give me the joy and happiness of the sun-worshipping Egyptians in their hymns to the sun anytime. I see no need for a bigot who mindlessly dismisses their entire culture based on narrow-minded prejudices.


Why not check out the quote from Manly P Hall that Tat provided me with? I've pasted it on my sig. It's not about the sun. The Egyptians would have laughed at you if you showed what you wrote above to them, and probably given you a little patronising pat on the head too. It's not about the sun. They're just using that as a symbol.

Nick

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"So the ancients considered the sun as the principle symbol of deity. No ancient person of wisdom or insight ever thought of the sun as that being, but rather the mirror of it." - Manly P. Hall

"Every plant, which my heavenly Father hath not planted, shall be rooted up." - Matthew 15


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 15, 2008 6:25 am 
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Actually, I've listened to that episode (or whatever you call it) and actually it is about the sun. The whole thing is about solar mythology, mixed in with other opinions that either agree or disagree. So, no the Egyptians would not have laughed at Freethinka or anyone else here. The stories of the gods took place up in the heavens (space actually) and over the years it was anthropomorphasized and the astrotheology became almost unrecognizable.

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 15, 2008 6:40 am 
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Nick, are you dense?

"You are the central cause of the universe actually, Tat. Had you bothered to look. You are the mystery, and it is this mystery that the universe is calling you to examine....directly. Not through endlessly studying symbol sets and trying to convince yourself they're all the same, but by turning your awareness around and examining who you are. The Kingdom of God is within You, dude. That's a literal statement."

This is what I've been saying the entire time. "Tat Tvam Asi" means "You Are It". I've been stressing that "I", and "You", and "Everyone", and "Everything" ARE IT.

Are what?

THE MYSTERY CAUSATION OF THE UNIVERSE.

Nice way to repeat what I've been telling you all along as if it's YOUR opinion all of a sudden now.

Nick, you ass backwards idiot, you've been arguing against the premise of absolute "mystery" almost the entire time, yet now you've decided to post my own position on the mystery back at me as if it were your position all along.

You need to get a grip on yourself Nick.

Guess what, all of these traditions of mythology are riding on that "mystery" (function #1 of world mythology) that you started out disagreeing with in the beginning, and have since decided to accept, and have now attempted to shoot back at me as being your own personal understanding that I need to accept.

That you would start an argument about "mystery" with me in the beginning, only to later agree on the mystery after I pointed out to you that it's a metaphor for the "transcendent", and then later come at back me and present the "mystery" as if it's something that I need to find within myself, after I've been telling you the entire time that "the mystery is the whole (within and without)", shows a significant "flip flop" style personality disorder going on in your mind.

"Thought Happens"

Nick, you've been saying that all along when you've been backed into a corner.

Well guess what, if your position is that "thought happens", then everything that thought consists of "happens".

Conceptualization "happens".

Categorizing "happens".

Position taking "happens".

What is "within you", is same as what is "outside of you", because there is no actual inside and outside as being distinctly separate from one another! There is only mere existence with no borders, boundaries, divisions, starting point or stopping point.

What appears to be within is also without and what appears to be without is also within. You lack an understand of reality as holistic by the direction you've taken on this thread.

Had you have actually gone within you would have discovered that within is without and without is within. And after discovering that, you would have given up on thinking that the seemingly external objective world is something to be rejected or viewed as being apart from you.

You and the Sun are "one".

You, Jesus, and the Sun are "one".

You, Jesus, and the Sun, are the "effects" of the causation of the universe.

You are the "effect", just as Jesus is the "effect", just as the Sun is the "effect".

The "effects" point back to the "cause".

The "cause" is present in every "effect".

I've laid it all out here.

This is what astrotheology is suggesting in these traditions.

If you agree that You, Jesus, and the Sun point to the causation of the universe, then you are in agreement with the basic premise of ASTROTHEOLOGY.

_________________
The Jesus Mythicist Creed:
The "Jesus Christ" of the New Testament is a fictional composite of characters, real and mythical. A composite of multiple "people" is no one.

The celestial Origins of Religious Belief
ZG Part 1
Jesus: Hebrew Human or Mythical Messiah?


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 Post subject: THE POWER BEHIND THE SUN
PostPosted: Tue Apr 15, 2008 8:36 am 
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Here's where you just can't grasp reality, Nick227. Not only is it about the sun, it's about many aspects of the sun.

As Acharya writes in her book Suns of God, the ancients perceived the sun in a variety of ways, including but not only the PHYSICAL SUN. I don't give a shit what Manly Hall says in that one sentence. Nor do I care what mental masturbation you are obsessed with that prevents you from enjoying the natural world. Nor do I have any interest in your bigotry and prejudice that insists Jewish mythology and mindgames are superior to Pagan religious ideas - that's Old World, Nick. Old Testament supremacy of the Yahweh cultists - not interesting, not enlightened, nothing new... dull and boring.

If you knew anything about the subject matter you pretend to be an expert in, you would realize that the Egyptians, for example - who would not only laugh at *YOU* but would find you blasphemous in your stupid and insulting remarks about their religious beliefs - worshipped or revered every aspect of the sun that could be perceived, INCLUDING THE PHYSICAL DISK OF THE SUN, which is called by the sacred name ATEN. Ever heard of AkhenATEN? No, of course, you haven't, because in your all-knowing expertise, you've got your nose so far in Jewish religious supremacy texts that you can't see through your bigotry. The existence of the god Aten - the divine solar disk - proves your selection of Manly Hall's quote to be WRONG, as does the mythology of many other nations. The ancients were interested in every aspect of the sun, 227 - they weren't the world- and matter-hating Gnostics that you love so much. Why do you hate the world, Nick? Are you afraid of it? Are you running away from yourself? You belong to a world-hating cult, Nick - you can free yourself and love this world. This is HATE SPEECH against the world.

And, while you're in kindergarten trying to lecture the grad students, Acharya covered this business of different aspects of the sun within solar mythology and astrotheology many years ago, including not only the physical sun/disk itself but also the power behind the sun - Acharya's discusses that often. And she knows that people obsessed with Jewish supremacy are constantly trying to force other people to believe that the Jewish god Yahweh is that power behind the sun, so they can destroy the Pagan beliefs. But you wouldn't know any of that, because, as is typical of a rabid egotist, you haven't studied Acharya's work but merely pretend to be an expert on it (and other subjects).

You're just Church father Eusebius in disguise, with the same boring and insulting arguments put out by him and others, in order to destroy the religions of other peoples. Here's a quote describing YOUsebius from Suns of God (pp. 48-49) -

Quote:
One of the most influential of Christian writers, Church historian Eusebius (c. 230-c. 341) likewise asserted the superiority of Christianity, while acknowledging that its competitor Paganism was astrotheological. In "THE ORATION [OF] EUSEBIUS PAMPHILUS, IN PRAISE OF THE EMPEROR CONSTANTINE," Eusebius calls Jesus "the Sun of righteousness," a common designation based on the biblical text Malachi 4:2, a book and verse immediately preceding the New Testament, which shows that the gospel story was to be based on a hero with solar attributes.

In his plea, Eusebius addresses the astrotheological and element-worshipping Pagans, disparaging them and considering them absurd for givng such things "equal honor with the Creator of them all..." In fact, Eusebius speaks many times of sun worship, apparently in an intensive effort to convince the Emperor into switching his religious allegiance from Sol Invictus--the Unconquered Sun--to the power behind the sun, i.e., "God."

In his condescending propaganda dismissing the wisdom of the ancients in order to impose the supposedly "superior" Christian ideology, Eusebius further confirms that astrotheology was the dominant form of religion, calling those who practiced it "our ignorant and foolish race," who were "incapable of comprehending him who is the Lord of heaven and earth..." Instead, he complains, they "have ascribed the adorable title of Deity to the sun, and moon, the heaven and the stars of heaven," as well as "deifying the earth, elements and creatures themselves."

If the snarky Eusebius is right, then your selection of Many Hall's statement is WRONG, because the ancients quite clearly worshipped the creation itself. So do millions of Hindus, for example, even today. But, the ancient peoples that you and your Christian counterpart Eusebius are spitting on ALSO knew very well about the POWER BEHIND THE SUN. They weren't stupid, but the snide disparagers trying to set themselves up as superior always try to make everyone believe that.

And here's another quote from Suns of God (p. 121) - in that 600-page book Acharya writes about ALL the aspects of the sun.

Quote:
...Osiris was the "moon god" insofar as he was the light in and power behind the moon.

You see, Acharya - and we who have read her work - KNOWS about the power behind the sun, as did the ancients themselves. Yes, they saw the disk as a SYMBOL of deity, AND they worshipped that symbol as well, because, unlike you, they didn't HATE THE WORLD.

Do we get it yet? No? Here's some more from SOG (p. 125) -

Quote:
Symbolizing the light and power behind the sun, once in Babylon the Persian Mithra was infused with the more detailed astrotheology of the Babylonians and Chaldeans...

So, in your bigotry towards astrotheology, you also disparage the Babylonians and Chaldeans. Who's next, the Incas? Let's burn them all at the stake!

As you can see, the ancients built entire cultures around astrotheology - hey, let's hate them all!! Woo hoo! I get to hate!

Here's another quote from Suns of God (pp. 61-62), which displays a far greater knowledge of the subject than you will ever have, because you've already expressed that you despise it and are utterly ignorant of it.

Quote:
In many cultures, the sun has been considered not only the "savior" but also the great healer and physician, of both bodily and spiritual illnesses. The sun has also been believed to prevent nightmares and protect against demons. He (or she) is the bringer of good fortune, peace and prosperity. The sun was also the spiritual head and keeper of the mysteries. As Indian scholar V.C. Srivastava states in Sun-Worship in Ancient India, "it is said that as the Sun is veiled by his rays, similarly the ultimate reality is concealed in ignorance." The sun officiates over betrothals and weddings, as well as initiations, including into the priesthood or other mystery school/brotherhood. At such times, he is invoked through prayer and devotion; daily prayer is also commonly prescribed in the sun cult. Likewise, he is invoked during construction, of hearth and home, as well as destruction, when the body dies. The sun presides over death; he is the conveyor and purifier of the dead. The sun has been invoked as the Angel of Death against enemies, and, although mainly perceived as good and benevolent, in areas plagued with excessive heat he was considered evil and malicious as well....

"In Russian folklore the Sun possessed twelve kingdoms - the twelve months or signs of the Zodiac. He lived in the solar disk and his children on the stars. They were served by 'solar daughters' who bathed them, looked after them and sang to them."

And finally -

Quote:
For a long period of prehistory and history, the religious mind of the world has been focused on the "sun of righteousness," both the visible solar orb and the cosmic, divine power behind it.

So, while you continue to ignorantly split hairs and insult our intelligence, we've already got these bases covered. Talk about a BORE!

nick227, your denying everything due to your ignorance, bigotry, prejudice and Pagan hatred has grown old and boring. Take yourself a break from this forum - the time has come for you to acknowledge these facts and to make the necessary adjustments. Come back when you've moved out of the trollhood.

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 15, 2008 11:16 am 
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He should also read Tom Harpur's Pagan Christ too. In it he discusses that the Christ myth is the Horus story set to a Jewish theme and not only are the gospels a rewrite of it, but John is that story of Horus. Horus is an Egyptian sun god also.

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 15, 2008 2:21 pm 
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As if we don't understand the ancient notion of the power behind the sun here at the TBK forum.

Really Nick, you need to let it go.

You're wrong.

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The Jesus Mythicist Creed:
The "Jesus Christ" of the New Testament is a fictional composite of characters, real and mythical. A composite of multiple "people" is no one.

The celestial Origins of Religious Belief
ZG Part 1
Jesus: Hebrew Human or Mythical Messiah?


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 15, 2008 3:50 pm 
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It's basically a domination game, a game of 'spiritual alpha dog'. A friend of mine always had this need to be in the role of 'teacher'. He used to try to "bring me into the NOW" with every conversation we had. It was intrusive, uninvited and unpleasant. Nevermind ridiculous. It's all about domination and elevating oneself.


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 15, 2008 4:21 pm 
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James,

You're right.

He's sitting here trying to teach us what we already know. There's no authority when it comes to people who are aware of the transcendent reference in myth. If you understand then that's it. There is no deeper than understanding that the depth is infinite and boundless.

He's talking as if no one is aware that Jesus, as representing the Sun, represents the unknown cause that the Sun is used to represent in astrotheology.

Saying that Jesus is much deeper than the Sun is only to suggest that the "Sun" is much deeper than the "Sun".

We already know that.

None of this means that Jesus is not the "Sun" in the mythic dialogue by the way - he is.

The "cause" speaks through the "medium" of the Sun/Jesus in the mystic dialogue as Blavatsky points out.

"I am the light that is over all things; I am all"

This combines the Sun (effect) with the "cause" of the Sun. This is what's happening when the priests wrote John 10:30 "I and my Father are one".

The cause (God) is present in the effect (Jesus/Sun).

Basic astrotheology 101 in other words.

_________________
The Jesus Mythicist Creed:
The "Jesus Christ" of the New Testament is a fictional composite of characters, real and mythical. A composite of multiple "people" is no one.

The celestial Origins of Religious Belief
ZG Part 1
Jesus: Hebrew Human or Mythical Messiah?


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 16, 2008 8:28 am 
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Joined: Fri Jan 11, 2008 9:53 am
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Location: Dorset, UK
Mriana wrote:
Actually, I've listened to that episode (or whatever you call it) and actually it is about the sun.


Well, I don't know so much about Manly P Hall, but he did start off his explanation by saying that the ancients weren't actually talking about the sun, they were just using it as a symbol. Whether he's right I don't know. But he is quite well regarded, I think, and seemed pretty adamant.

Nick

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"So the ancients considered the sun as the principle symbol of deity. No ancient person of wisdom or insight ever thought of the sun as that being, but rather the mirror of it." - Manly P. Hall

"Every plant, which my heavenly Father hath not planted, shall be rooted up." - Matthew 15


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