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PostPosted: Fri Dec 18, 2009 3:25 am 
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National Geographic's "Ancient Astronomers" discusses the 35,000 year old cave painting/mural depicting the zodiac at Lascaux in Southern France with archaeoastronomer, Chantal Jegues-Wolkiewiez.

Quote:
"France's Lascaux caves have long been celebrated as one of the world's best examples of Paleolithic art. These 35,000-year-old animal depictions were thought to have represented life during the hunting season, but French researcher Chantal Jegues-Wolkiewiez has theorized that in actuality, these murals are a celestial map of the night sky."

- "Ancient Astronomers"

Here's a short clip from the National Geographic:

Stone Age Zodiac


http://www.tv.com/shows/naked-science/a ... s-1313228/

Prehistoric Astronomers

Ice Age Astronomers

Lascaux cave paintings
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lascaux_cave

BTW, this is all mentioned in Suns of God on pages 30, 31 & an image on 59

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PostPosted: Fri Dec 18, 2009 7:26 pm 
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Fascinating! She is basically demonstrating the astrotheology of the ancients. One day soon, we hope, the world of academia will recognize that word and field as quite legitimate.

There is no reason ancient man could not have observed his natural surroundings, including and especially the night sky. What else was there to do? And mankind during this era was anatomically exactly the same as we are today - same cranium and brain size. From these images, it is clear there were artistic geniuses among them, geniuses who could also have been expert at charting the skies, as we know the Polynesian sailors were some 30,000 years ago.

So much to watch, so little time. Thanks for posting that - and all the rest you do here. :wink:

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PostPosted: Sun Dec 27, 2009 5:48 pm 
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Here's a great article worth checking out.

What the Lascaux Cave Paintings Tell Us About How Our Ancestors Understood the Stars

Quote:
"Lascaux is a World Heritage Site and late Upper Paleolithic cave complex in southwestern France that belongs to the Magdalenian Culture. Lascaux’s cave paintings were made c.15–18,000 B.C. The sophistication of the Lascaux cave paintings is extraordinary when considered against their great antiquity. Their subtlety, complexity of technique and metaphor are qualities we can immediately relate to. The full articulation of this cave art reveals a mind akin to our own. If time and language barriers could be set aside, it is very possible that Magdalenian people of the late Upper Paleolithic would understand us, and that in return we could understand them."...

Quote:
"...Mathematical aspects in late Upper Paleolithic mythopoetics derived from observational astronomy. Some cave paintings recorded an understanding of the path the moon takes around the sun – the ecliptic. An understanding of the ecliptic leads to the discovery of the zodiac, the annual path of the sun through the celestial sphere. A construct for the zodiac then follows, in which it is divided into twelve sections later known as ‘houses’."

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PostPosted: Sun Dec 27, 2009 5:53 pm 
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Here's another one
Quote:
THE ZODIAC

"One of the most interesting interpretations of the cave paintings at Lascaux in France is that the paintings were actually animal representations of the zodiac. A paper was presented at the International Symposium of Prehistoric Art in Italy, which stated the belief that the cave paintings at Lascaux were records of the zodiac constellations, fixed stars and the solstice points. Chantal Jeques - Wolkiewiez showed that all the constellations of the zodiac except Aquarius and part of Pisces are represented by the animals of that time. She believed that this together with the presence of the setting sun demonstrated that the painters were remarkable observers of the sky.

If this is indeed the case, early man preceded the Babylonian astronomers by 10,000 years. To have done this early man would have had to measure distances between stars and Jegues - Wolkiewiez believes they did this with sticks as rulers, she believes that they were already using the stars as heavenly guides to find the position of the stars that were not visible above the horizon. She and a colleague studied the paintings carefully, keeping in mind that the sky then was different from ours today. They made measurements with an astronomical compass, and conjectured that the rays of the setting sun at the summer solstice penetrated into the cave and touched certain paintings. She checked her theory on the summer solstice, June 21st 1999, and saw that the setting sun hit the entrance for 15 minutes, and lit up the painting of the Red Bull on the back wall of the Hall of Bulls.

In the prehistoric zodiac, the constellation Taurus – the Bull – culminated in the summer solstice. The entire Hall of Bulls is proposed to correspond to the constellation of Taurus. There is a picture of two bulls facing each other, these align with the constellations of Taurus and Scorpio, which are not in the sky at the same time, so strengthens the theory that prehistoric man possessed a direct knowledge of astronomy, and also mathematics as they may have had the ability to calculate and project the positions of the stars regardless of their visibility.

Some experts believe that the caves at Lascaux should be treated as an isolated incident, and that with the millions of stars in the sky, there would always be some that could be found to be in correspondence to the paintings or to anything.

We may never know the truth, but it is fascinating nevertheless."

http://historyday.crf-usa.org/1708/zodiac.htm

Here's a brief time-line
http://historyday.crf-usa.org/1708/timeline.htm

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PostPosted: Sun Dec 27, 2009 8:09 pm 
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Quote:
A lot of paintings are related to the zodiac and the study of the stars. Some could be related to a form of religion, so it’s possible that the stars could have been gods to Prehistoric man.

Now where have I heard that before? :)

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PostPosted: Sun Dec 27, 2009 9:40 pm 
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Quote:
"A lot of paintings are related to the zodiac and the study of the stars. Some could be related to a form of religion, so it’s possible that the stars could have been gods to Prehistoric man."
http://historyday.crf-usa.org/1708/introduction.htm

Quote:
Now where have I heard that before?

Justin the Martyr's "...Devil got there first"

LMAO!!

:lol:

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PostPosted: Mon Feb 22, 2010 3:23 pm 
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Here's an Astronomical Timeline

http://www.rundetaarn.dk/engelsk/observ ... meline.htm

Here's the time line from above

http://historyday.crf-usa.org/1708/timeline.htm

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PostPosted: Mon Feb 22, 2010 5:43 pm 
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I like how they decided to add this date to the timeline:
Quote:
4004 BC
On 23 October at 0900, the Universe was created, according to the Anglican Archbishop of Armagh, James Ussher.

:lol:

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PostPosted: Tue Nov 19, 2013 5:34 pm 
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Amazing Astronomers Of Antiquity


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 14, 2015 4:34 pm 
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Were the twelve Patriarchs and the twelve tribes of Israel and the twelve disciples of Jesus based on the twelve signs of the zodiac?

Josephus, Philo & the Zodiac

Testimony of Josephus and Philo

"The claim that the 12 tribes of Israel were identified with the 12 signs of the zodiac is spelled out clearly by the ancient Jewish writers Philo and Josephus, during the first century. During the first century BCE, Diodorus Siculus identified the 12 tribes with the 12 months.

"See Exodus 39:9-14: "...they made the breastplate... And they set in it four rows of stones... And the stones were according to the names of the children of Israel, twelve...according to the twelve tribes."

As Josephus says (Antiquities, 3.8): "And for the twelve stones, whether we understand by them the months, or whether we understand the like number of the signs of that circle which the Greeks call the zodiac, we shall not be mistaken in their meaning." (Josephus/Whiston, 75.)

Earlier than Josephus, Philo ("On the Life of Moses," 12) had made the same comments regarding Moses: "Then the twelve stones on the breast, which are not like one another in colour, and which are divided into four rows of three stones in each, what else can they be emblems of, except of the circle of the zodiac?" (Philo/Duke, 99.)"

- Christ in Egypt, 261-2

As we can see, by the first century it was well known that the theme of "the 12" was astrological in nature.

For more:

The Twelve in the Bible and Ancient Mythology

Jesus as the Sun throughout History

Star Worship of the Ancient Israelites

2,750-year-old solar-aligned temple discovered in Israel

Astrotheology of the Ancients

Freethinkaluva22 wrote:
National Geographic's "Ancient Astronomers" discusses the 16,000 year old cave painting/mural depicting the zodiac at Lascaux in Southern France with archaeoastronomer, Chantal Jegues-Wolkiewiez.

Quote:
"France's Lascaux caves have long been celebrated as one of the world's best examples of Paleolithic art. These 35,000-year-old animal depictions were thought to have represented life during the hunting season, but French researcher Chantal Jegues-Wolkiewiez has theorized that in actuality, these murals are a celestial map of the night sky."

- "Ancient Astronomers"

Here's a short clip from the National Geographic:

Stone Age Zodiac


http://www.tv.com/shows/naked-science/a ... s-1313228/

Prehistoric Astronomers

Ice Age Astronomers

Lascaux cave paintings
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lascaux_cave

BTW, this is all mentioned in Suns of God on pages 30, 31 & an image on 59

^ That came out in 2009, so, it has been around 6 years and National Geographic still has never made the DVD available. What's up with that? Please contact National Geographic to put in the request to make the DVD available.

As a back up in case Nat Geo deletes the trailer:

Stone Age Zodiac by National Geographic
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xk8R6IyM5Ec

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 02, 2015 7:27 am 
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I, too, have scoured the internet looking for this particular episode, and have been unable to find anything.

I have made an effort to contact Chantal Jegues-Wolkiewiez, as well as the publishers of Seasons 1 and 2 of Naked Science, and will report back.

I found someone on Facebook who says in the NatGeo page's comments section for this particular episode of Naked Science that they had recorded it on DVR, so I reached out to them and am awaiting responses.

What would be the best way for me to contact NatGeo?


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 12, 2016 10:34 am 
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Quote:
Chauvet-Pont d'Arc: 'Cave of forgotten dreams' paintings 10,000 years older than previously thought

"Radiocarbon dating in the Chauvet-Pont d'Arc cave, southern France, has revealed a new chronology of human and animal occupation of the site during the Paleolithic era. Classified as a World Heritage site in June 2014, the cave's walls are decorated with some of the oldest prehistoric artworks ever encountered.

Previous analyses had dated the charcoal drawings back to 22,000–18,000 BC. However, the comprehensive dating program carried out in the cave now indicates a much older age (32,000–30,000 BC) for the black drawings, which are the only one in the cave datable with the radiocarbon-dating method. All the results are published in the Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences....."

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